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Post by shiftless on Mar 19, 2011 1:36:25 GMT -5
Uh oh, we got trash talkin' already. I like it!  Let the smak talk begin ! :nana: 170cc pro :checkered: :checkered: :checkered: KOTH :checkered: :stumped: Good time :rockon: |
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Post by 2strokd on Mar 19, 2011 7:01:50 GMT -5
Ahhh, hahaha  . The guy with over twice the size motor comes over and trys to type smack  . Good luck this year Skipper, your gonna need it |
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Post by 2strokd on Mar 19, 2011 7:03:33 GMT -5
Be sure to bring your little baby bottle :freezing: :rofl: :lol:
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Post by shiftless on Mar 19, 2011 12:14:23 GMT -5
Ahhh, hahaha . The guy with over twice the size motor comes over and trys to type smack . Good luck this year Skipper, your gonna need it HaHa you might do ok...... if you ride something besides the portapotty !! LOL |
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Post by 2strokd on Mar 19, 2011 17:45:21 GMT -5
I kept my taillight so you would have something to fallow through all the smoke from my 2T and :burnout: :devil:
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Post by motorhead on Mar 19, 2011 19:54:34 GMT -5
I've been watching the 2010 "Twist N Gone" video and I was wondering if you guys from this forum would mind identifying yourself or your bike if you were in the video. I'd love to be at the next event but the distance is just too far from FL  |
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Post by 90GTVert on Mar 19, 2011 20:15:48 GMT -5
I've been watching the 2010 "Twist N Gone" video and I was wondering if you guys from this forum would mind identifying yourself or your bike if you were in the video. I wasn't there, but I can help out a little. shiftless = Skipp rocketdog = Charles enviromoto = Jeremy lagerhead = Ben 2strokd = Robert (also gave us a shoutout HERE ;D ) wt100 = Tim (behind the camera) If I missed you and you're a member, sorry. Post up. |
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Post by motorhead on Mar 19, 2011 22:10:24 GMT -5
Thanks Brent, it's going to make rewatching the races a bit more interesting.
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Post by 2strokd on Mar 20, 2011 12:00:03 GMT -5
I did very poor at TNG and didnt make the finals  . My scoots cvt was off but i still was fast enough with three 8gram sliders to win in my class but i got heat sick and couldnt finish :barf: . That sucked :censored: . Im looking to do allot better this year tho ;D. Wish you could make it motorhead! Its a hoot :nana: |
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Post by motorhead on Mar 20, 2011 12:46:48 GMT -5
Is there a web page that has the complete results of every race posted from TnG 2010  ? I'm really itching to show up, I just don't want to show up and bring a Killer Bike and get DQ'd like Daniel Koch. His Piaggio Fly was Ill but it just seemed like he got DQ every other time he hit the track lol. I just don't want to travel 1000 miles to get that happen to me. What was up with him? |
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Post by 90GTVert on Mar 20, 2011 13:14:35 GMT -5
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Post by 2strokd on Mar 20, 2011 14:53:42 GMT -5
As far as i know he was used to the way the tree is set over were he is from. He kept accidentally redlighting and DQ,ing himself.
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Post by motorhead on Mar 20, 2011 18:54:55 GMT -5
I hope I'm not asking too much but could Jeremy or someone at the event explain to those of us who are new to Legal drag racing. Or point me to the info. How do you prestage, stage and properly leave the starting line at Twist n Gone?
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Post by 90GTVert on Mar 20, 2011 20:08:09 GMT -5
I wasn't at T&G, but I've spent plenty of time at drag strips around me, so it should go basically like this. You get into staging lanes. In practice and test and tune type events, sometimes you just pick a lane and get into it, sometimes there are specific lanes for specific classes. At an event like this, I assume they call up your class and they'll show you where to line up. Once you're next in line to prepare to race, someone should be there to signal you to pull up to the burnout area sometimes they will signal you when it's OK to start a burnout and sometimes they won't let you pull into that area till it's time for your burnout. I'm really not well versed on the burnout procedures for scoots, but basically I don't think anyone but the folks putting down some pretty serious power should need to do a burnout. In cars, generally the folks with street tires bypass the water box (an area that is hosed down to get the tire(s) wet so burnouts can be started easily) and just "clean off" the tires by giving them a quick spin. Racing tires require some heat to hook well, and you can actually hear the engine drag more when they are good to go if you're used to it. Sometimes the track official will wave you ahead to let you know you've got 'em hot. Again, I think most of this is bypassed at this scooter event, but who knows, what you might bring. So once the burnout is done, assuming the racers before you have finished, you should get a go ahead to pull up and stage. There is a "tree" with a bunch of lights, triggered by staging beams that go across the track in the starting area. When you pull up enough, you will break the first beam and the top yellow pre-stage lights for your lane will light up. As you pull up slightly farther, you will break the second beam and the stage lights will come on. At this point, you are staged. Some racers do choose to "deep stage". Deep staging is when you continue to move forward until the pre-stage lights go out, so your vehicle is farther ahead than regular staging. Deep staging can hep you if you are having trouble getting a quick reaction time and it will put you slightly ahead of the other guy in a heads up race. I don't believe deep staging is allowed in all events, I don't know that there is a rule either way setup in NASRA yet. Staging the standard way will get you better ET and MPH, albeit very slight, because you are actually rolling a little faster when you leave the final beam. OK, so now that you are staged, you will need to wait for your competitor to stage as well, if they aren't already. Some tracks or organizations have regulations regarding how long you can take to stage before being DQ'd. Nothing you should need to worry about, you generally have plenty of time. Once everyone's staged up, the tree will be started. There are three rows of large amber lights, then a row of green lights, then a row of red lights. For the setup that NASRA uses, a full tree, the top amber will light, then .5 seconds later the next amber down will light, then .5 seconds later the final amber will light, and .5 seconds later the green will light up. If you leave before the green, the red light will come on, meaning you left early or "red lighted" and you will be disqualified. In a pro tree, all three ambers come on at the same time, .4 seconds before the green lights. You have to be careful not to let the scooter roll or push a little or anything once those ambers start or you could leave a beam and get a DQ. Here's some info, largely pertaining to bracket racing that I posted on NASRA's forum to help out a bit. It goes into a little more detail about the lights and reaction times and will explain bracket racing a bit as well, although of course Twist & Gone is heads up. " Bracket racing is an art. It actually favors a person with a slower machine in many instances, although it's not as much of an issue with scooters as in higher powered vehicles that are likely to have traction issues, wheelstands, or things of that nature. I used to go to a local drag strip every weekend when I was younger. I wathced an old lady in a bone stock 80's Chevy Caprice running 21 seconds in the quarter mile taking home the big trophy at 50% of the events next to heavily modified cars running as low as 8 seconds in the quarter mile.
As Jeremy has pointed out briefly, there are two major factors determining who wins in bracket racing. Those are dial in and reaction time.
Dial in is incredibly important, and something you should work on over the course of the season. You can't make one or two passes and come up with a dial in that will have you winning every event. Most people start off with a dial in that is a couple of tenths faster than their initial runs. That's done to avoid the chance of running faster than your dial in and being eliminated. As you get more runs in and examine your time slips, you can begin to get your dial in closer to ideal. An experienced racer will look at every spec to from reaction time to 60ft to MPH and determine what he/she may be able to gain here or there. The really good folks will adjust for changes in weather conditions as well. It appears that all of your runs are in the daytime there, but many tracks start in the afternoon and run into the night. Dialing in right on the edge for a warm afternoon can have you breaking out when the cool night air comes around. It really does take a lot of skill to get a good dial in and in the most competitive classes you are always running a risk of breaking out with a good dial in.
Anyone using a power adder for better results in bracket racing runs a great risk of breaking out. Just a little too long on that button and you are DQ'd for dropping under your dial in. It's a calculated risk. The idea is to get just ahead of the other racer and hope that you didn't break out. If you use a power adder like nitrous and end up many car lengths (scooter lengths?) ahead of your competitor, either they had a horrible run or you just lost.
Another thing with bracket racing and dial ins is a mental issue that actually favors the slower racers. There's something about watching another vehicle leave the light many seconds ahead of you that makes you feel like it's an impossible race and you have to do everything you can to win. That often leads to red lighting and breaking out for the faster racer.
Of course that brings us to reaction time. Saying that a .500 reaction time is a perfect light confuses a lot of people. Shouldn't a 0.000 reaction time be perfect? Here's why less than .500 seconds is a red light and a disqualification. You guys are using a full tree. This means that once you are staged (I'm not even going to get into staging and deep staging, but there's more to look into if you are really serious), there is a delay and then the top of the three amber lights illuminates. 0.500 seconds later, the second amber light comes on. As you could guess, 0.500 seconds after the second amber bulb lights the third and final amber bulb comes on. Once again, it takes .500 seconds for the green light to illuminate after the final amber. The reaction timer starts when the third amber lights. Since it takes 0.500 seconds for the green light to come on after the final amber, anything below 0.500 reaction time means that you left before the green light came on, and thus you are eliminated for red lighting. Essentially, you left before the race started. If you have a .500 reaction time, you left at the exact moment the green light lit. That's cutting a perfect light. Anything above .500 means you left after the green light was on for some time. For example, your reaction time was quoted above as 0.876 and Jeremy's was 0.639. He left the line just .139 seconds after the green lit. You took .376 seconds to start. That gave Jeremy over 2 tenths of a second of an advantage toward beating you to the finish line, because reaction times are not a part of your elapsed time (ET). The reaction timer starts with the green light, but the elapsed time starts when you actually move and trip the beams to start the timing equipment. A racer that can cut .500ish lights has a big advantage for that reason.
My first suggestion to improve upon reaction times, is to hit the gas on the last yellow. My second suggestion is to try online practice trees to get a better feel for things if you aren't able to get a lot of real track time in. Just remember that your experience in real life may need to be adjusted from what you see online on practice trees. Most vehicles don't respond at the exact moment that you give them throttle. There are products out there that allow you to adjust practice equipment to similar specs for your vehicle if you are really into it. For that reason, you may need to adjust your style a little. At any rate, practice makes perfect and you're bound to cut some red lights getting it all figured out.
racewindsor.com/Trees/sportsman.html
performancetrends.com/Drag_Race_Practice_Tree.htm
Hopefully all of that makes some sense and helps folks newer to this style of racing understand what it's all about." I'm sure that's more info than anyone ever wanted, but that oughta do it. If I left something out, ask and maybe I can help. I also have to note, as much as it sounds like I know about this stuff, I suck at drag racing at the strip. There were periods from maybe 14 to about 27 years old that I went to the strip every weekend either helping a friend that races or just watching. Nerves really kick in for some of us when it's time to get up there though. lol I did it once in my car. Made one run and got kicked off the track for going too fast without the proper safety equipment. I did a one wheel peel with a tire still in the burnout box. I went past the staging beams completely and had to reverse. Then I still deep staged accidentally. My reaction time was 1.0 something because I just waited for the green since I didn't really care about winning. Besides, it was an import beside me, I woulda needed to let off half track to lose.  Point being, don't feel bad if it doesn't go perfect at first. |
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Post by motorhead on Mar 20, 2011 20:29:49 GMT -5
Brent... :popcorn: That was fantastic! I've read up on staging and tried to watch the races closely but never got it untill now. I'm sure there are others as well who come from the land of "hot girl dropping the kerchief" who needed the information.
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