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Post by 2smokeruck on Jul 9, 2018 23:52:47 GMT -5
I think you bought the wrong gears. Met gears are taller (except the restricted mets which have the same gears as rucks). What people do is put a ruckus swingarm which is a bit longer so it gives it a slight stretch and put met gears in. You dont necessarily need to that.
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Post by Trigger1212 on Jul 10, 2018 12:55:39 GMT -5
2smoke,
Before buying the gears I went on Bikebandit and looked up the final drive gears for a MetII and compared them to a Met I. They have different part numbers and if I remember correctly the Met I has 2-3 more teeth (taller gears).
I found the gear set on ebay that matched the PNs for the Met I, the listing said it was for a Ruck. Don't know if they are or not but I do know that they match the Met I which is what I wanted in it. I guess I should count the teeth just to make sure! Bottom line is that I still THINK I have the right gears.... Thanks!
Cheers!
Wade
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Post by Happypancake! on Jul 10, 2018 16:59:16 GMT -5
My opinions only :
Slow jet : 38
Main jet : 78 or 80
CDI is your next move.
Use stock Bando Belt
Met II gears are Ruck gears.
Met I final gear 45t vs 47t ruck
Met I countershaft 13t vs 12 t ruck.
You need the full Met I gears if still using Met swing arm.
If you switch to Ruck swingarm w/ 130/90 rear tire and still have stock cc’s, I’d run Ruck gears w/ the 45t met gear.
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Post by Trigger1212 on Jul 11, 2018 22:22:38 GMT -5
HP
My bad, I put some incorrect info in my last post. Here is the correct data:
1. I went went with your recommendation and ordered new jets. Installed the 38 slow jet and ordered both the 78 and the 80 main jet. Currently have the 80 installed, have not tried the 78.
2. The listing on eBay SAID it was a Ruck final gear set. I then went to bike bandit and looked up the part numbers on line and compared them to the numbers for a MET I and they match. I purchased the final gear 23430-GET-000 (45T), countershaft 23421-GET-010 (13T), and the counter gear 23422-GET-000 (42T).
So as far as I can see I have a set of new sealed in plastic bubble wrap MET I gears which is what I want correct?
Have you swapped these gears out? Wondering if it’s a PITA to get the final drive gear out of the housing and getting the bearing off the shaft.
PS, I had also taken your advice and kept the original belt.
Cheers!
Wade
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Post by Happypancake! on Jul 11, 2018 22:45:49 GMT -5
You seem to have a lot of mech knowledge. Easy to swap. Open the case and you GET it figured out. It’s a scooter not a trans rebuild.
Cheers !
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Post by Trigger1212 on Jul 12, 2018 8:51:51 GMT -5
HP Duly noted!  Yeah I've turned a few wrenches in my day. So bloody busy with work and kids in college I guess I subconsciously looking for a reason to not have to roll up my sleeves and dive into this. As per most everyone else on this forum, too many irons in the fire! Challenge accepted, I'll report back when done, thanks for the kick in the pants... Cheers! Wade |
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Post by Trigger1212 on Aug 22, 2018 19:58:44 GMT -5
Happypancake,
Thanks for the jab to get me going. Job is now complete, it was not without a couple hitches but it is done. It was actually a very easy swap when it's all said and done and I would encourage anyone to do it if they were thinking about it.
Drained the oil out then removed everything down to the bare case, carefully split it noting the orientation of all the gears and the steel shims. Pulled the gears out then laid them out in order on cardboard next to the scoot for reference. Got the case sealing surface cleaned up and checked out the bearings/seals in case, all good.
Looked at the new gears and counted teeth vs old ones and confirmed that they were indeed the same gear teeth count as that of the Met I, so we were all good on that score. The only confusing thing was that the new counter shaft gear had a different configuration. I should have taken a picture of it but was in too much of a rush and my hands were oily. If you look at the "Met II Redux" build by jbjhillbilly he has a photo up that does an excellent job of showing the difference.
Essentially the new gear has a flange on one end that appeared to take the place of the steel shim, i.e. with the flange there would be no need for the shim. At least that was my thought. Did a trial fit with the steel shim in place and it all worked so sealed it up and called it good. The black ATV I used needs a full 24 hrs for a full cure so I let it set. The next day I was getting ready to fill it with oil and grabbed the old gears to store them in the parts bin. When I picked up the gear that slides on the counter shaft I noticed ANOTHER shim was stuck to the opposite side that I had never seen. Sheeeeee - it! Hate when that happens! It was a nylon shim that was used on the non-thrust end of the counter shaft. Tear it all apart again, clean it all up, install the shim, start the screws to make sure everything is turning freely and all gears/shafts fare full mated and then screw it all back together and let set for another 24 hr cure.
Went back out the next day, installed variator and clutch and was ready to install tire and noticed the output shaft, final drive axel, would not turn. Good grief Charlie Brown! As soon as I realized that it would not turn I was sure that the shafts were bound up because of the extra width of the nylon shim. Tear it apart again, getting pretty good at cleaning the mating surfaces now... Sure enough the shim showed evidence of being pinched between the case halves. I then measured the length of the old and new countershaft and noted the same thing that jbjhillbilly did, the new shaft is longer, about .057" longer. Hmmm, now what to do? If I removed the steel shim it probably would have been still too tight, I wanted the nylon washer in there as I wanted the non-thrust side of the gear protected as the case would still be subject to thrust on deceleration. I ended up leaving the steel shim in place and sanded the nylon shim down to about half it's thickness using the back flat on my bench vise. That was a real PITA and took a while but ended taking abot .023-.025" off. Trial fit it all dry with the screws tightened and the shafts all turned freely. Pull it all back apart, final clean, reseal, assemble and cross the fingers! 24 hrs later still turned freely so added oil and installed all the rest of the bits and pieces.
So how did it all work out? With the exception of the Met II exhaust the scoot is now in full Met I configuration. The final drive mod caused a slight loss in pick up at the low end, but I did gain higher top end and cruise speed. Prior to this mod I was turning about 7,300 rpm at 30 mph, now it's right at about 7,000 rpm at 30 mph. If you have no head wind, crouch over the bars and hold it wide open you well end up, eventually, around 38-39 mph, at around 8,100 rpm. Overall I would say it was worth doing.
Prior to the mod the scoot would hit the rev-limiter function of the ECU at around 8,200 rpm. Now I go faster than that but the motor cannot get to the full 8,200 rpm and the rev-limiter. I guess the higher gearing is just a little more than the motor can handle.
Question: The scoot has the original Met II exhaust pipe on it. My theory is that the pipe has a restriction in it and this is not letting the motor produce it's full top end torque. Does anyone have experience that can confirm this?
Is there a better pipe to put on than the stock Met I pipe? I do NOT want a loud pipe, completely happy with the quiet ride as it stands. Would appreciate any input on this.
No sense installing the NY CDI if the motor cannot hit the current rev limit, and I don't think a little more ignition advance will make any difference at all.
Cheers!
Wade
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Post by Happypancake! on Aug 22, 2018 20:25:14 GMT -5
You'll GET there. The MetII exhaust is restricted with a welded plug inside the header. The older MetI (2002-2004) have a larger header than the Rucks.
Carb - The METII diaphragm is longer than MET1. I may have an extra.
(https://www.partzilla.com/product/honda/16050-GET-671?ref=0c27f83a3447b31dd23fdfdd1b403d16ffa8ec2e)
Variator - Still full travel?
Jets- 38/80?
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Post by jbjhillbilly on Aug 23, 2018 2:36:27 GMT -5
Sorry you hit the same snag I did with the washers and gears. I know for me it was nerve wracking. Glad you figured it out (and I hope that my pics helped).
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Post by Happypancake! on Sept 1, 2018 20:27:42 GMT -5
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Post by Happypancake! on Mar 13, 2019 21:32:08 GMT -5
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Yeah I've turned a few wrenches in my day. So bloody busy with work and kids in college I guess I subconsciously looking for a reason to not have to roll up my sleeves and dive into this. As per most everyone else on this forum, too many irons in the fire! Challenge accepted, I'll report back when done, thanks for the kick in the pants...
