jack667
Scoot Enthusiast
Posts: 190
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Post by jack667 on Sept 30, 2018 12:30:18 GMT -5
Thx Ryan and Geoff - I'm going to out a temp and a tach gauge on order. Probably should have done that in advance... I know I was advised... We broke in the new piston and cylinder with hilly neighborhood rides of 5, 5, 10, and 10 miles. Each with at least a 3 hour cool down. The we took it for a test run at full throttle: the 5.5 mile ride to school. Not much traffic today - Sunday. It was great! I took a video and I posted it to youtube and linked it here. Pretty long and boring, but maybe someone wants to see the school commute. He topped out at 55mph on a downhill, never got much slower than 40mph, (two spots of high 30s...) and went up most hills at 40-45mph. So - we pretty much met out goal. I'll bet there's more there if we just tune it, and I also have some more parts en route to try next weekend. One issue though, was that it wouldn't start up for the ride back home! We stupidly left the kickstarter off so we had to go home to get that. I was following him in my truck. When we got back to the bike, we first put on a battery charger and it went from a healthy 12v to 13v. I didn't take down exact numbers, but I'm pretty certain that the battery was not the issue. I then popped off the tranny cover to make sure clutch bolt and variator bolts were tight and the belt looked good. All good. I then replaced the '7' plug with an 8, and then we tried to start. Still nothing. I was afraid it seized. And then we tried the kick start and it fired right up. Before leaving the school lot, it konked out as I tried to coach my kid to take it easy on the way back, and then we needed the kickstart again. He rode it home at almost wide open, taking some breaks here and there. After about 10 mins of being parked, I tried the ignition and it fired right up. The idle does seem low, but I doubt that's the problem. I should get this spark plug figured out. Any other ideas? Thx! Jack |
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Post by geoffh on Sept 30, 2018 15:05:38 GMT -5
Congrats on the build,I run mine a bit rich and it,s a pain to start when it,s warmed up ,looking forward to your next tune up
Geoff
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jack667
Scoot Enthusiast
Posts: 190
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Post by jack667 on Sept 30, 2018 20:11:07 GMT -5
Congrats on the build,I run mine a bit rich and it,s a pain to start when it,s warmed up ,looking forward to your next tune up Geoff Thanks Geoff! I appreciate the encouragement! I'm heading out for a business trip for 4 days so my kids going to be without his mechanic this week. I'm hoping the next 4 days go smoothly. After that, I'll be tweaking it on the weekend. Here's what I'm hoping comes in and is ready to install: - sport airbox - doppler intake and Stage6 reed box - Malossi MultiVar variator - Dr Pulley 5g weights - Malossi RS1 rear shock (280mm) - TTO tach and temp - Nology hot wire (this is the only item that's already here) Hoping to get it all in and do some testing. I'm thinking of using my bicycling app (Strave) to do the comparisons. Not sure if anyone is into that, but it seems like it's a good model. GPS, over a defined segment, top speed, total time, and distance. Repeatable. It just wouldn't account for environmental changes like wind, ambient temp, humidity, etc. Once I get the temp and tach, I should be ready to rock the tuning... Jack |
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Post by repherence2 on Oct 2, 2018 20:31:30 GMT -5
I would recommend a Cylinder Head Temp gage so that you don't end up soft seizing your new bore, just stay below 350°F. Hi Reph! I'm looking at CHT gauges and see the Trail Tech TTO one. Question to the 49cc gurus... Should I buy the one that connects at the spark plug for my 2T Zuma? Or is there some other one to get, that connects to a fin, or something other than the plug. Thanks in advance!! smile.amazon.com/dp/B071HKW8R9/ref=psdc_404769011_t2_B01H7QA5OKJack  Jack, yes I use the TTO temp gage with the ring on the spark plug. I also use a TTO tach. I also bought the extension wire for the temperature probe because the standard wiring is short. So with the extension wire, I have my tach and temp gage mounted in my speedometer cluster. I made 2 cut-out widows on the speedo cluster face. Both gages sit underneath the clear cover so it is protected from rain. I also used some spacers to backspace the gages with a gap so that the illumination lamp for the speedo cluster provides light to read the gages at night. The gages don't have lights of their own. In regards to the temp probe, depending on the cylinder head, you may have to grind/clearance some of the fins so that you don't damage the probe and wires. The wire coming out of the probe is fragile and thin and there isn't much strain relief to protect it. I also cut a slot on the cooling shroud near the spark plug hole to avoid pinching the wire. |
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jack667
Scoot Enthusiast
Posts: 190
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Post by jack667 on Oct 3, 2018 0:17:56 GMT -5
Great info as always, Reph!
The parts came in today but I’m not getting home till Thursday from my work trip. Curious if i should order some kind of extension wire as you suggest, or wait till I get home to know of the standard version fits. I wonder if I’d need an extension for both, or just the one wire
I’d certainly prefer to get it installed this weekend...
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Post by geoffh on Oct 3, 2018 15:31:11 GMT -5
Jack, not that you have asked but along with the upgrades have you a break down no start plan for your rider ??in the UK winter and dark nights are just around the corner so I have a chat with the wife and plan what to do if snow or ice make scooting dodgy.failing to plan ect,ect
Geoff
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Post by repherence2 on Oct 3, 2018 20:36:31 GMT -5
Great info as always, Reph! The parts came in today but I’m not getting home till Thursday from my work trip. Curious if i should order some kind of extension wire as you suggest, or wait till I get home to know of the standard version fits. I wonder if I’d need an extension for both, or just the one wire I’d certainly prefer to get it installed this weekend... The TTO tach wire is long enough to reach the speedo cluster. The temp gage wires are short. The weird thing is that the temp gage extension wire costs almost the same price as the complete temp gage kit here at the local moped shops. But if you are handy with wiring, you could make your own extension with small gage speaker wire. |
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jack667
Scoot Enthusiast
Posts: 190
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Post by jack667 on Oct 4, 2018 7:31:19 GMT -5
Jack, not that you have asked but along with the upgrades have you a break down no start plan for your rider ??in the UK winter and dark nights are just around the corner so I have a chat with the wife and plan what to do if snow or ice make scooting dodgy.failing to plan ect,ect Geoff Geoff - I think this is great advice. We've talked a bit about this but probably not enough. Since the whole (typical) ride is 5.5 miles, a breakdown mid-ride should probably result in calling parents and if someone's available to come get him and sort it out. If neither of us is around, then he should probably lock the Zuma to a tree and walk home (afternoon) or to school (morning). Defintitely worth talking it through - thx for the tip! |
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jack667
Scoot Enthusiast
Posts: 190
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Post by jack667 on Oct 4, 2018 7:34:18 GMT -5
The TTO tach wire is long enough to reach the speedo cluster. The temp gage wires are short. The weird thing is that the temp gage extension wire costs almost the same price as the complete temp gage kit here at the local moped shops. But if you are handy with wiring, you could make your own extension with small gage speaker wire. Ugh - you were correct. The tach cable is long enough but the temp cable is way short! Damn. I am handy enough with wiring. So, just slice in some speaker wire? I can do that... Jack |
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jack667
Scoot Enthusiast
Posts: 190
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Post by jack667 on Oct 7, 2018 14:10:31 GMT -5
Question for the experts, and and update Update first: Part 1: I was able to install the temp and tach today. Thx to Reph for the heads-up about extending the cable. That was a piece of cake, and it was super-helpful to know that it could be done. The spark plug collar made it pretty tough to get the plug back in. Quite a pita. Not sure if it was more due to the bbk or the plastic shroud, but it was tough to get the plug started on the threads and I was worried about cross-threading it. (Now I re-read reph’s post above where he warned me about all that.) One other item is that the tach gauge is a surface mount and the temp gauge is recessed. I don't know if I ordered the wrong thing, but I just went with it. I had to mount the temp gauge on a 90 degree angle, but it's still readable, just a bit odd. Otherwise, all set with the install. Part 2: Now that we've got those gauges on, I feel much better and not so worried about 'flying blind'. I told my son to go out for a test ride, and to watch for RPMs - stay below 9500, and temp - stay below 325. He came back and was pretty disappointed. The temp was fine, maxing out at 290, but the tach was a problem. He had to back off on the throttle to keep the RPMs in check. Going up hill, he was max throttle and 9k RPMs, so no issue there. But on the flatter areas, he was holding to 9500 with a bit of throttle left. He figures he could easily be in the low 10s. Going down hill, he had to back way off. He maxed out at almost 10,500 and he figures that if he was going full tilt, it might get to 12k. Questions: What's your opinion on Part 2 above - and what should we do, to maximize speed wrt our goals? (Btw - we’re very close to our goals, just shy, and i still plan to do some tuning with variable weights, intake, and airbox when those orders arrive) I've seen elsewhere that 10k is dangerous with stock crank like we still have. Do you agree that we should max out around 9500 or 10k? Or is it safe to go higher? Should we look at higher gearing? I've been thinking that would really hurt the uphill giddy-up, so I'm not sure if that's going to be an overall positive result for us... What about temp for 325 as extreme caution with 350 max. Is that reasonable for a Yamaha 2T? Thx!! Jack  |
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Post by geoffh on Oct 7, 2018 14:55:20 GMT -5
Nice to see you up and running. Bbk,s are not my thing I run just past stock,44 mph is just enough for me,I,d call it done as you have it now make sure you have the mixture right and maybe go to premix fuel if your using those high rev,s,the auto lube system has a history of cfailures.
Geoff
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Post by moofus02 on Oct 7, 2018 15:16:20 GMT -5
I've got a 08 with stock bore and Leo vince zx pipe that runs mid 40's. With a sport kit i wouldn't worry about as much as 10500. My pipe holds my rpm back but i don't have a tach on it so i don't know. I do know it would go faster with taller gears. Big power high rpm and small pin is a problem. With the kit you are running you should be OK with stock oil pump and running it up into the 10's. Peace of mind might make the pin bearing a item to change every so often
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Post by 190mech on Oct 7, 2018 17:59:21 GMT -5
Remember throttling way back on down hills cuts back the oil supply(with a cable operated oil pump),goosing it every few seconds helps..BBK installers sometimes reset the oil pump for more oiling,OR,go to premix...  I see you said NCY pipe,which one would that be?? |
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Post by moofus02 on Oct 7, 2018 18:53:04 GMT -5
The yamaha doesn't have a cable on the pump like the clone. Weird but they work
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Post by ryan_ott on Oct 7, 2018 19:27:25 GMT -5
I think the weak link in the build is the wrist pin needle bearing if it’s never been replaced. I didn’t see any mention of it being replaced with the bbk. Just try to reduce the urge to over rev it down hill. Gears will bring the willingness to rev into check. I’d recommend 43/13 but if your afraid of losing hill climbing then 15/50 would help.
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