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Post by GrumpyUnk on Jan 30, 2020 11:29:27 GMT -5
Before adding more power with a BBK, I'd want to know how well they handled. I expect the drive wheel to spin a lot in the mud, curable with chains or knobby tread to a degree. I have no doubt the handling would be somewhat 'interesting'. I worked on a DongFang reverse trike, the front wheels on that could be tilted in either direction to help cornering and balance. I guess I am saying that without the ability to 'lean' much, the 'things' might be a handful to drive at any speed except slow. Get someone to take a video as you slide around. tom
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Post by FrankenMech on Feb 7, 2020 2:56:43 GMT -5
With the front suspension locked on a dongfang reverse trike it will have a turning radius of about 50 yards. It 'pushes' very badly, extremely dangerous.
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Post by 2stroked on Feb 7, 2020 14:04:29 GMT -5
With the front suspension locked on a dongfang reverse trike it will have a turning radius of about 50 yards. It 'pushes' very badly, extremely dangerous. That's what you started with, wasn't it?
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Post by FrankenMech on Feb 7, 2020 23:59:27 GMT -5
I still have it, -with modifications, and more mods pending...
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Post by 2stroked on Feb 9, 2020 8:58:47 GMT -5
I still have it, -with modifications, and more mods pending... 1200 V Twin? Maybe an old 750 triple 2t? Just, please, not an LS swap.... I've seen too many of those. Everyone and their brother has an LS in everything. Maybe an eciboost with bigger turbo....
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Post by FrankenMech on Feb 10, 2020 0:39:31 GMT -5
Probably just a 125/150cc engine with a chain drive. I hate rubber band drives.
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Post by 2stroked on Feb 13, 2020 20:40:33 GMT -5
Probably just a 125/150cc engine with a chain drive. I hate rubber band drives. There is a lot to be said for the CN 250 style CVT engines. Those Helix bikes are HEAVY and still grab 75-80 easily...
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Post by FrankenMech on Feb 13, 2020 22:07:08 GMT -5
I want to keep it looking like it could be a 50cc. A 125cc is legal in Kansass. I don't need to go fast, I just need more torque for hills. Even my 50cc will smoke the v-belts with constant full speed operation. With a #40 chain drive geared to run somewhere 35-40MPH I won't be losing half the power to belt friction heat.
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Post by 2stroked on Feb 14, 2020 18:59:06 GMT -5
I don't get it man, I've seen some ridiculously heavy, 50cc kart with 4t CVT motors flat move, and not slip a belt, unless it leaks, or has an issue somewhere. I do agree the belt drive is a weak point, but you have won the shitty CVT lottery with yours. Even big ass 600-800cc sno-cats use CVT, same with side by side and a lot of light duty UTVs, hardly ever, if ever, hear of a belt slipping, or burning, unless there is a bad problem somewhere.
Does your trike have the reverse box?
I do not doubt what you say, it simply has me fascinated, as I've not seen this before. The worst issue I have ever had from a CVT was my new Helix flipping the belt inside out...that was......interesting.
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Post by FrankenMech on Feb 14, 2020 20:03:49 GMT -5
No reverse. The R-trike is not a good energy efficient design due to high rolling resistance. With my balance it is my only option. Flat moving is not an indication of efficiency or reliability. Just because something 'works' for a while does not mean it is a good design unless it is a disposable rocket or a firearm. A single V-belt drive is limited to about 5HP, when you add belt slippage in a CVT application and high ambient temps it is a recipe for failure. I think a lot of scoot engineering has been reduced to the ragged edge of failure in order to reduce cost. The rapid accumulation of belt dust is another indication of failure and energy loss, so is the heat. Rubber belt drive CVT's just suck. I have seen designs with metal belts. I will never use a rubber belt CVT on anything I build.
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Post by GrumpyUnk on Feb 18, 2020 13:47:32 GMT -5
Frank, you may remember that I worked on a DF reverse trike. It sure seemed to have minimal rolling resistance, even pushing it uphill to the driveway. Is it possible the front wheel bearings are on the way out? Have you checked them for free spinning when off the ground? They should spin like a bicycle wheel. Are the brakes adjusted properly? Brake drag can make anything run like it is sludge. The rear drive is standard 139QMB, more or less, so no special thing there. If you are getting a lot of belt dust, check that the belt is not slipping. Heat indicates slippage, I would suspect. Or something else. Have you replaced the clutch or the variator? Could one or the other be out of alignment, which, I think, could cause more heat as the belt binds/rubs against one side or the other of the 'vee'? Have you attached a tachometer? Getting the rpm vs velocity response/action would give a picture of what kind of things are going on in the CVT. I installed a BBK on a GMW, and the rpms on that would increase, seem to catch up, then start to climb again with no change in speed. New belt, and things got a lot better. After selling it, the purchaser was going down hill at 45+, and bingo, he ate his belt. I am pretty sure his clutch came apart internally, and suggested he purchase a complete new clutch. I went over to return the trike I had worked on, and he did not have a clutch, which I would have installed free. It was internally messed up, even with a brand new belt installed(old was shredded, the one I had just put on a week before). It didn't allow the engine to run properly and sounded like the engine was toast. Pretty sure the rpms were so slow that the engine was making noise as if it had thrown a rod. He eventually got a new clutch. DF makes some intriguing 250cc rated cycles using the same engine/chassis with different wheels and details. I am an old classic style bike fan, and would love to spend a bit on a new machine... but Mama would not like. The Sym Classic 150 is the style that appeals, along with the Boom and the San Gabriel(?). I can dream. No charge. tom
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Post by FrankenMech on Feb 18, 2020 20:10:09 GMT -5
Thanks Tom, The wheels and brakes are good. The increased rolling resistance is due to the tiny amount of toe in required with two front wheels. Currently it has toe out due to the bent frame. From the descriptions and pictures posted it does not get more belt dust than others. I have a tach and use sliders, the CVT seems to operate properly. I should have bought a 150cc to begin with. There is zero market for used scoots here and they are few and far between. I don't need speed I just need torque for hills so I think a larger engine and a chain drive will do OK. There are lots of motorcycles here of the HD or crotch rocket types. Even my son has one.
Right now I am too sick to work on anything.
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