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Post by Deleted on Dec 18, 2020 19:59:44 GMT -5
Well, on the weekend I was going to work on the other bike, my primary, the RT50, decided to have a fit. Here's what happened.
Was feeling a bit of a lag in my throttle yesterday morning. Figured carb needed cleaning and I would hit it after work. Well scooter dies on the way home, so short walk of shame and then picked up by friend. It died under about half throttle, and I was looking for spot to coast to when it fired back up again while coasting. When it fired back up, was able to get it to a gas station then walk it a bit from there.
So I got it home and set to work. Cleaned out the carb completely. Reattached the carb and fired it up. Everything seemed alright so I took for a check ride. Made it to end of street. When I hit the brake, she shut down on me. Wouldn't restart on electrical, so I kicked it and got it back home. Pulling into drive, I notice the engine has a weird sort of clicking sound and a whirr.
I figure maybe I missed something. Drained the gas and re-clean the carb paying special attention to pilot jet. I also start checking around to see if I can see anything leaking. Notice gasket at exhaust looks like it's missing piece, figure air leak and replace gasket. Leave it for the night cause I gotta work early.
Today after work I came home and changed the fuel filter to be on safe side. Also checked air filter, everything seems alright. Fired up the bike. She seemed to idle alright. Rode it around the block a few times, stopping and starting, seemed okay, but I notice a vibration and a whirring noise from lower right side when I let off the throttle. After a few minutes of this I notice that it's getting harder to get revs up and idle seems to be getting weaker. Get the bike back home. Idle is really weak. I go to give.it gas and it dies. Hard to restart. Have to kick a couple times. Starts up with the low idle, then fluctuates higher and lower. Ticking/clicking sound is back and seems to be coming from behind the fan/stator cover.
It seems that bike is running just fine, and acceleration is strong when cold, but once the bike warms up, the wackiness seems to start. Pulled plug and it isn't wet. Trace oil on the threads but plug isn't fouled.
So, I'm trying to figure this out. Could be an air leak? I intend to go.searching for that in morning. Is it perhaps something shook loose and messed up the stator? Maybe a seal or in internal issue? I'm trying to avoid chasing things around the bike, but there are a lot of variables.
If anyone has had a similar issue crop up on them, I'd appreciate any pointers. I'm a start digging into it bright and early tomorrow.
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Post by samyscoot on Dec 19, 2020 17:07:16 GMT -5
i had a similar isue but it was just the carb float that was sitting too low in the carb bowl. In youre case i would look into the sound remove the ignition rotor and look behind it if there is nothing there it could be youre crank bearings or 1 has gone bad since you heard a thicking sound and a lot of vibration those are symptomes of a bad crank bearing. if youre crank bearings are bad you're seal would be bad 2 that could be the bad idling and running because an airleak is the most noticeable on low rmp and hard starting.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 26, 2020 20:39:43 GMT -5
Well, it was the oil pump. Completely died on me. I was running ULTRA lean and burned up the piston, bearings and seals. Well, looks like the Malossi BBK I got for Xmas is going on the bike. Got the case split, bearings pulled today. Piston looks alright. No wiggles or weirdness. Cleanup reinstall tomorrow. Oil pump and tank going to trash. Am pre-mixing from now on.
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Post by Zino on Dec 27, 2020 9:51:39 GMT -5
That piston is ugly Malossi sport cylinders are a nice solid upgrade and safe on stock crank. They spin up to around 9500 rpms with a wide like stock powerband .
Take some pictures as you build it back up so you can help the next guy . Especially if you have any cool tricks like using bread to take the bearings out
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Post by aeroxbud on Dec 27, 2020 10:07:42 GMT -5
You are going to love the Malossi kit.
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Post by yambw’s on Dec 27, 2020 12:43:04 GMT -5
Love the rt50 always wanted one called a street magic in the U.K.! Is it a morini engine in that? I had an italjet formula (same morini engine I think?) that had engine problems in the end I think it could of been the pump I wonder if it’s a common fault on the morini
It’s got me thinking about the Aprilia Sr morini we are doing, only problems that the pump feeds bearing directly so I’m guessing you can’t delete it ?
Have you looked in to this for your RT?
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Post by Deleted on Dec 27, 2020 23:46:46 GMT -5
Well! Cases are back together! I tried two different methods for installing the new crank bearings. On the stator side, I used the oven method. I got it to work but I can honestly say it isn't for me. Too difficult to maneuver case around, even good heat gloves on. Bearing went in slightly off-kilter but a couple taps with the rubber mallet set it right. It was just too much work. For the transmission side, I used the heat gun method. All I can say is - HELL YES! super smooth and easy. Heated around the opening on high setting for a good 10-15 until I could feel warmth about midway through the case. Yanked the bearing out of the freezer and popped it right in. So simple. That is how I intend to do the next motor. To get the crank in, I used a Tusk Crank Puller on both sides. I don't really like to plug things, but this tool made my life so easy. I hooked it up and it pulled the crank into the case smoothly and easily. Life saver. I put the liquid gasket on the liquid gasket on the seams, used the Tusk to join the halves, then bolted everything down. Other than the initial mishap with the oven method, all went surprisingly well. Now I'm just waiting on the liquid gasket to cure. Tomorrow I'll reassemble the back end of the bike and get the head put on.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 28, 2020 0:21:50 GMT -5
Forgot to mention. I used Barkeeper's Friend to clean the mating halves of the cases. Stuff is fantastic at cutting through residue, it's cheap and safe-ish, and you can use it on all kinds of other stuff around the house. It's really good to de-crud stainless steel pots without damaging the finish.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 28, 2020 0:26:14 GMT -5
That piston is ugly Malossi sport cylinders are a nice solid upgrade and safe on stock crank. They spin up to around 9500 rpms with a wide like stock powerband . Take some pictures as you build it back up so you can help the next guy . Especially if you have any cool tricks like using bread to take the bearings out Now how's that for a coincidence! I saw that video on YouTube the other day. Helluva lot cheaper than a puller see and slide hammer, right?
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Post by Deleted on Dec 28, 2020 0:39:16 GMT -5
Love the rt50 always wanted one called a street magic in the U.K.! Is it a morini engine in that? I had an italjet formula (same morini engine I think?) that had engine problems in the end I think it could of been the pump I wonder if it’s a common fault on the morini It’s got me thinking about the Aprilia Sr morini we are doing, only problems that the pump feeds bearing directly so I’m guessing you can’t delete it ? Have you looked in to this for your RT? Yeah, I remember the Street Magic. Was a Suzuki bike if memory serves. I do love the RT. She's quick and very nimble. The only real downside is that it's a super light bike at about 190lbs, so at higher speeds she gets a little floaty. It's not terrible, but if the wind kicks up above 20mph, it can push you around a bit. As for engine. It's an Adly Long/short case horizontal minarelli clone with the dreaded 878 belt. I say dreaded because they are difficult to find. Naraku makes a version but it's a bit short. After removing the oil pump, it just looks like standard injector set up. Oil goes from tank to pump to carb. Doesn't stop anywhere in between, so out it comes. Gonna add 3% when calculating re-jetting to compensate for premix.
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Post by aeroxbud on Dec 28, 2020 6:19:43 GMT -5
Good job. 👍 You can do it without the proper tools. But they make it so much easier. You could also put the bearings onto the crank first, then the cases. But I much prefer putting the bearings into the cases first.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 28, 2020 9:45:18 GMT -5
aeroxbud completely agree. The right tools make everything so much easier.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 30, 2020 21:49:16 GMT -5
It's ALIIIIVE! LOL! Holy smokes that was a stressful couple of day. Malossi kit fired right up on the third kick and she runs good and strong. I didn't really get a chance to take any photos as I went, but I have a project bike that will be getting the same treatment. I plan to take plenty then.
I moved my main jet from 84 to 90. The original main was 75, so I figured a 20% bump would be a good start. Turns out I think it is spot on. The couple times I've bumped wide open, bike flies. No hesitation, no sputtering, but also no whine. I think it's there.
I also completely raised the needle and midrange power is fantastic as well. Cruising seems great with tons of extra power when needed. Right now, I'm keeping it under 35 until it's a bit more broken in.
As for the pilot, I'm having a little trouble. The original was 17.5. Keeping to the 20%, that should be 21, but I do not have a 21 in my kit. I have 20 and 22.5. The 22.5 is what I put in on first fire up. It's a little rich, but it works. The idle is a little rough. I tried the 20, and it was not happy at all. Couldn't get it to stay on. Kept stalling out. I had a 25 on hand and threw that in. Flooded, so no. 22.5 is what it is for now. After what I went through with the last cylinder, rich is totally fine with me.
It could also be two other things. I have the stock airbox with the snorkel in. Curious if removing the snorkel might even things out a little. Also, I am running 32:1 during break-in, so I'm sure that is having an effect as well. After break in phase, I plan to roll back toward 40:1. I imagine that will also have an effect on the jetting as well.
Anyway, that's where I am with all of this. Please let me know if any of y'all see anything off about the setup. This is my first go round rebuilding and engine.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 31, 2020 21:23:25 GMT -5
That piston is ugly Malossi sport cylinders are a nice solid upgrade and safe on stock crank. They spin up to around 9500 rpms with a wide like stock powerband . Take some pictures as you build it back up so you can help the next guy . Especially if you have any cool tricks like using bread to take the bearings out As requested. Open blind bearing removed with bread. Took a minute and one slice of Arnold multigrain. 😂😂😂 Going... Going... Gone!!!
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Post by aeroxbud on Jan 1, 2021 10:04:08 GMT -5
A mixture of 32:1 is a lot of oil. Most sport cylinders only run at 50:1. And some race kits recommend 40:1. The extra oil will probably take longer to break in the cylinder. The piston and bore need friction to bed in.
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