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Post by Lucass2T on Oct 3, 2021 13:03:42 GMT -5
hellish100You could also do an overview of the 'working range' of certain parts. For example, a Yasuni C16 can be fitted to anything ranging between a basic cast iron 70cc (DR70, TP black trophy etc) and a bridge port alu 70cc (Polini Evo, MHR speed/cross, Metrakit pro race, Hebo racing etc). Same goes for cylinders. A stage 6 racing mk1 can be fitted with exhausts ranging for a basic tecnigas next-r up until a Yasuni c20/c21. Theres overlap with most parts, which might be a nice addition to the profiles list above.
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Post by hellish100 on Oct 3, 2021 17:42:58 GMT -5
Lucass2T Can you check the revisions on my page? What should I call the categories? Zino You are good at categorizing what to call certain levels of builds. Am I missing a column for 'Hyper race'?
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Post by Zino on Oct 3, 2021 19:41:52 GMT -5
Sport/Street Below 10 k rpm builds mostly cast irons
Mid Race 10k to 12 k rpm builds mostly Single Ring Aluminum or Ported Cast Iron Sports kits
Race 12k rpms and above Single ring Aluminum bridged exhaust ports
Lucass makes a good point . It helps a lot to buy parts that bridge classes just in case you keep build racier and racier builds . It also gives guidance on not overbuying beyond the class you are targetting . Hyper Race pipes for Sport builds are a frustrating combo
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Post by hellish100 on Oct 3, 2021 21:13:11 GMT -5
Thank you Zino ! Can you check my page again? I did a lot of edits and color coding.
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Post by Zino on Oct 3, 2021 21:21:52 GMT -5
I really think of only 3 Levels Sport under 10k rpms Mid Race 10-12k rpms Race 12k plus There is overlap between them
Whatever categories you use I would define them at the top of the page
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Post by hellish100 on Oct 3, 2021 21:49:58 GMT -5
Ok! That will make choosing components more simple for folks. I'll make another update before this time tomorrow.
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Post by Lucass2T on Oct 4, 2021 5:31:47 GMT -5
It might also be a good idea to include EAN numbers with every part listed (since 99% of the aftermarket parts are from EU manufacturers). That way there is zero confusion about what part it is you're actually talking about.
Also in the carb list I have some comments. Stock/original carb is perfectly suitable for a sport cylinder, given you are not using the top tier exhaust thats listed for that cylinder (e.g Yasuni C16, Stage 6 R1200 etc). A 19mm carb is also a very good choice for a mid-race cylinder. A 17.5mm too, but it should get the orange color. A 19mm also works perfect on a real race setup, go check the italian Polini Cup with true racing machines running 19mm's.
There's a whole lot that encompasses making such a list. You're on the right track but you're only getting started. Read through the Euro forums to get a feeling for what works setup wise. This stuff is/was big in europe for the last 25 yrs so theres a ton of info there.
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Post by hellish100 on Oct 4, 2021 18:59:20 GMT -5
It might also be a good idea to include EAN numbers with every part listed (since 99% of the aftermarket parts are from EU manufacturers). That way there is zero confusion about what part it is you're actually talking about. Also in the carb list I have some comments. Stock/original carb is perfectly suitable for a sport cylinder, given you are not using the top tier exhaust thats listed for that cylinder (e.g Yasuni C16, Stage 6 R1200 etc). A 19mm carb is also a very good choice for a mid-race cylinder. A 17.5mm too, but it should get the orange color. A 19mm also works perfect on a real race setup, go check the italian Polini Cup with true racing machines running 19mm's. There's a whole lot that encompasses making such a list. You're on the right track but you're only getting started. Read through the Euro forums to get a feeling for what works setup wise. This stuff is/was big in europe for the last 25 yrs so theres a ton of info there. This is going to take a while.
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Post by repherence2 on Oct 7, 2021 18:11:38 GMT -5
hellish100 , the best set up i had was the 94cc 54mm Taida set up. i was told by the mechanic/tuner at Motosource, "you keep spending hundreds buying fast parts for the 47mm stuff. just get a 90cc SMC Rex block, put up gears in it, and you will run with the Hondas all day long, strokers and all." because it outran all but 2 Hondas on the street, i stayed with that set up for simplicity, it never revs beyond 10k. less wear and tear. i did not get a SMC Rex block. i came across an 83cc Yamaha engine at chinese shop. bought it for $350. genuine Yamaha or not, i dont know. the CVT cover had another cover bolted over it and it was stamped/embossed "YAMAHA". my assumption is that this was an ATV engine. my assumption is that it has ATV gearing. i added a Malossi up gear. it never lifts the front wheel. top speed never GPS'd but the speedo was calibrated to 45mph via radar speed limit signs. i had to add two marks to the face so that i could get an idea of the speed once the speedo needle went off-scale past 50mph. just past the second black dot, the needle pegs out against the clear speedo cover. i ended up wearing down the tabs on the speedo gear input to the point where the speedometer no longer worked from pegging the needle against the clear cover. i ain't saying that it could do 70+. those marks are there just so i knew the relative speed of the bike. here in Honolulu, it is illegal for any moped to go faster than 33mph. i got ticketed for 49 in a 35 once. so the fastest verified speed of the set up is 49mph. i rebuilt a chinarelli a while ago. used Motoforce mid race big bore ported to Polini Evo 2 exhaust timings. Ruima 10 pin large taper large spline crank. Keli variator. NCY ignition. stock rear facing intake manifold (ported), polini cp24 carb. modified airbox. paired up with a Yasuni c21. never tested yet. hindsight 20/20. the best thing i ever did was porting a 47mm chinese bore. when i first bought the bore, i was a newb, it was just over $100 at a shop, and all i wanted was a "Big Bore Kit". turned out that it had low exhaust duration and i could never get it past 35mph no matter how much $ and parts i threw at it as far as CVT stuff. soft seized it several times. then i swapped out for a 47mm Malossi cast paired with a v8, keli variator, NCY lightened clutch, red NCY clutch springs, yellow NCY contra spring, stock chinarelli carb up jetted. so back to this China big bore kit: i started reading BigBnrg blog and the Tuning Matters stuff to learn about porting and timings. i ended up porting the China bore exhaust to the example of 21.5mm from the top of the bore. that thing was a monster. it ran pretty hot because it had significantly less cooling fins that the average cylinder. remedied that with a jog90 fan and an air scoop. it was probably super lean all along. i once asked one of the best minarelli tuners here for advice. he responded, "just stay below 350F and you will be all good." since then, i tune with CHT gauge and a tachometer. CHT for carb and Tach for CVT. people just need to understand how pipes and bores work. i was so dumb as newb, hard headed. learn the hard way in the form of broken parts and $ down the drain. i am a firm believer in tuning a carb via CHT gauge. i am a firm believer in tuning the CVT with a Tachometer. i believe that no matter what bore you have, the pipe is one of the limiting factors. i am a firm believer in the 28mm OKO carb for Wide Open Throttle performance. maybe people should read this information before they delve into full on tuning. i thought it was insightful. bigbnrg portingin the end, to each their own. my failures as a newb is experience gained. when i found BigBnrg, i used this as a guide. bigbnrg profiles
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Post by hellish100 on Oct 8, 2021 7:45:53 GMT -5
I had a 90 block and I stupidly sold it.
I have an idea and am redoing my webpage. I'll ask everyone's opinion once I have a working concept.
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Post by 90GTVert on Oct 8, 2021 12:01:16 GMT -5
I like the green>yellow>red coding. Yasuni used to do something like that with their exhaust recommendations.
You could probably make things simpler for the carb section in one respect. Instead of listing Dell and whatever else you may end up with there, maybe just size ranges. It could be more complicated though, because a 50cc sport and a 100cc sport would need different sizes. This is why I've never got into doing something like this. It's pretty tricky to figure out how to be accurate without creating an encyclopedia sized page. Thanks for the effort so far.
EDIT : If you want another cylinder for your list, the TPR 70/86. I'd prob put it as yellow for sport, green for midrace and either yellow or green for race. Again, more semantics/tricky crap to my brain. The 86cc has worked well for me at 10-11kRPM with a custom pipe and it works very well with the MHR Big Bore 86cc exhaust at 13-14kRPM.
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Post by aeroxbud on Oct 9, 2021 19:04:06 GMT -5
The only Minarelli horizontal engines I have had, are all water cooled. But will probably be similar to the sir cooled stuff you have with parts. First one was a Yamaha Jog RR. The only real modifications were a Yasuni Z, variator, clutch springs. Really woke the jog up. Such a light bike. My first aerox went through loads of changes. But cylinders and exhausts were. Yasuni Z. Worked great with the standard cylinder. Changed this to a PM Tuning 360, which is in my avatar. Great low reving pipe. But worked better with the stage 6 street race. The street race then needed a bit more, so the pro rep exhaust, and 17.5 Delly was fitted. The crank didn't last so long. This was replaced with the stage 6 crank and racing cylinder, and 24mm carb. Because why not eh? The pro rep was really holding the performance back. So a Yasuni C16 was added. Very powerful setup. Would wheelie off the throttle. But quite demanding to ride.
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Post by hellish100 on Oct 10, 2021 8:33:58 GMT -5
Ok, I just changed up the site a little bit. Check it out and let me know. It will be a lot more work to categorize this information but it feels like the biggest variables are the pipes and carb selection ( depending on what pipe+bore combo are made ). Let me know what y'all think! evnelson315.github.io/scooter/scooter.htmlEDIT: Only the info for the stock cylinder is really accurate and is the closest to a working concept. EDIT #2: I need to update it for mobile device screen width.
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Post by nelson on Oct 12, 2021 21:37:30 GMT -5
70cc Athena wc evo,Evolution, prius water pump,yasuni c16,21mm carb, mhr crank and malossi overange. Not too wild and makes a decent cruiser. Wc is the way man, I'm in texas and tuned ac don't last long when you run em hard. Sorry a bit late replying. Gonna shut up now and see what's transpired Have bult others but nothing to talk about.an experiment I did was polaris 90cc outlaw. Just have to mod rear break line. Was hoco cylinder cheap crank and pipe. Would cruise 50 and had great torque for city traffic
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Post by Lucass2T on Oct 13, 2021 3:27:54 GMT -5
You've put the wrong picture with the Stage 6 Race MKII. In the picture is an oval port cylinder. The Stage 6 race has a bridged port. This is what I meant with ppl confusing various parts with each other. Put the factory product code below so people can easily google it and always find that exact part you are describing (S6-7416607). Also describe if there's 10 or 12pin choice, kinda crucual detail to take into consideration if you are shopping for parts (which I assume this list is meant for...).
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