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Post by aeroxbud on Jan 13, 2021 15:51:13 GMT -5
I hope they can shed some light on what you are seeing. It's almost like the carb is too big. I was gonna ask if they make a smaller Lectron I think 30 is as small as they go.
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Post by 90GTVert on Jan 13, 2021 17:54:25 GMT -5
I contacted them some time ago directly about a carb. They didn't recommend anything for my application. Not sure if they had 30mm carbs at that point or not though. Even if they did make a 24-26mm, I'm not diving in to the thousand dollar level with a second carb.
I don't think the problem is actually that the carb is too large though. I mean, the power jet was adjustable and responsive at one point.
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Post by CrankingWithCG on Jan 13, 2021 20:56:14 GMT -5
I contacted them some time ago directly about a carb. They didn't recommend anything for my application. Not sure if they had 30mm carbs at that point or not though. Even if they did make a 24-26mm, I'm not diving in to the thousand dollar level with a second carb. I don't think the problem is actually that the carb is too large though. I mean, the power jet was adjustable and responsive at one point. It doesnt seem too big. Maybe a bit from the sound, has more drone in it, but its not "too big". I personally noticed very minimal affect on my GY6 with a 28mm power jet carb (i know, different motor, but still). I think dirt bike motors have different flow than scooters that make the power jet more effective. Or it is just truly that small and niche of an adjustment. I hardly noticed much difference from your video except when you opened it up 6+ turns, which at that point its just pissing out fuel so itd obviously have an affect that far
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Post by 90GTVert on Jan 16, 2021 12:21:38 GMT -5
I got the kickstart stuff together with a different spring and gear and then when I went to test it by hand, I realized there was little resistance from the engine. Compression test showed 60-65psi, with 165-170psi being my previously observed healthy result. It could be that the power jet could never be tuned because of dropping compression I suppose. Maybe that's why it worked at one point and then didn't. Found this : I would assume a combination of lean mixture at part throttle and high ignition advance. I always get a ring around the edge without color, but this has a sandpaper texture and chunks missing. I think the issue is exacerbated by the Lectron's lean part throttle, with CHTs over 200F for cruising when they were usually 170s-180s with my tune in the Dell and only lean spikes in spots that just weren't right that would hit 200 if held there. My WOT bursts don't even usually go beyond about 230 and I've seen part throttle up there with the Lectron. I do have 3 degrees of advance beyond MVT's initial spec, but it runs hardest that way. I never tried more advance than that. It already seemed to be on the edge, but with a little extra fuel I could get away with it to some degree. I don't really want to back it out. After taking measurements, I think I'm going to order a C piston for this B cylinder. It appears to be about 0.01mm larger than new, so that should work well. Last time I inquired about a B or C piston from ScooterTuning they said 4-6 weeks, so it's probably gonna be a bit. In the meantime, I think I'll contact Lectron about metering rod options. Seems like I should be able to get richer part throttle cruise and be able to have good response. I could do it with the Dell. I just wanted to make a simple vid about a Lectron install and what it did or didn't do for me. I'm working on finishing another hour or so long video with repairs, tuning, and more fails. I may have to do a cutdown "remix" when it's all said and done, just about the Lectron so it doesn't get lost in all of my engine failures. This is discouraging to me, between probably looking like a fool that can't tune a carb to dumping more and more money into a setup that I wanted to be done with.
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pewpew
Scoot Enthusiast
Posts: 254
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Post by pewpew on Jan 16, 2021 12:30:54 GMT -5
Maybe it could be safer to use mvts recommended specs until the carb is all set?
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Post by 90GTVert on Jan 16, 2021 12:52:40 GMT -5
Maybe it could be safer to use mvts recommended specs until the carb is all set? That's probably a more sensible thing to do after seeing this. I've pushed back against the idea, but it may come to that. I just emailed scootertuning.ca to ask about getting a C piston, if there's any chance the S6 subframes will be back, and I also asked if they've experienced lean part throttle since their site lists it as their go to carb for 85 to over 100cc engines. I've got 2 new kart pumps on the way. Same thing I was using. $40 each shipped. That should get me through a few thousand more miles anyway. I don't trust the plastic stuff that much and the billet stuff probably isn't that much different for costing roughly $100 more. Other options would require new bracketing. This thing is aggravating me enough right now without that.
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Post by aeroxbud on Jan 16, 2021 13:01:58 GMT -5
Well that's not good. This is getting pretty expensive. 😢
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Post by Lucass2T on Jan 16, 2021 15:15:43 GMT -5
Well that's not good. This is getting pretty expensive. 😢 It's just teething problems. Don't forget, Brent is basically a pioneer. He's venturing into unknown territory at this point. Nobody is being this persistently and actively trying to make a 14.000rpm Minarelli a daily driver. Most of the kids already would've given up by now because of lack of funds or motivation. Brent, as long as you don't let the youtube commenters decide on your goals, stick to your own plan, you'll get this right!
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Post by captincvmn on Jan 16, 2021 22:06:18 GMT -5
I’m gonna try and post a .gif. try to at least. Found a short video of Brent testing a Lectron carb on a jet ski Jet ski test
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Post by 90GTVert on Jan 17, 2021 2:46:24 GMT -5
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Post by yambw’s on Jan 17, 2021 3:05:31 GMT -5
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Post by 90GTVert on Jan 17, 2021 14:22:00 GMT -5
I just looked at Lectron's metering rod chart. Maybe it's just me, but I'm having a hard time understanding exactly where I would want to go. All I really gather is that the leanest rod is a 0-0 and the richest is a 19-4. It's not like they say anywhere what the numbers actually relate to. If I had to guess, I'd think the first number of 0 would be the largest diameter and 19 would be the thinnest. The second number could be related to taper or length, though I'd guess taper or maybe it tells the small end diameter. I dunno. With needles you usually have multiple data points like largest diameter, smallest diameter and taper length with charts to show you what's what. Currently a 2-2 rod, seems rich enough at up to maybe 1/8 throttle, then it's lean till the power jet comes in. Prob have to stick to the original plan of emailing them. At $30 each plus shipping, it's not like buying needles for a DellOrto at $5-10 each where you can grab a selection and swap if your guess is off.
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Post by captincvmn on Jan 17, 2021 15:06:40 GMT -5
We should start a betting pool. Everybody gets a square.
I want 4-1
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Post by 90GTVert on Jan 19, 2021 10:58:16 GMT -5
ScooterTuning got back to me and said the piston is expected to take 5-6 weeks. None of their suppliers carry them, so it has to come from the factory directly. Makes me wonder if anyone else actually measures anything or they just buy a new A and toss it in... or do they go in the trash when they don't run? Realistically, .01mm is .0004". Clearances open up so quickly in full thousandths that it probably doesn't matter which one you have for long, aside from maybe being a bad idea to toss a D piston into a brand new A bore.
I also asked about the S6 subframe for a rear facing carb and that isn't expected till probably summer.
I asked if they had trouble with the Lectron and lean part throttle, but was told that he didn't have experience with it. I was planning on contacting Lectron anyway, but waiting to see if perhaps there was some scoot specific info from them first. Not a big deal. I don't think I'll see a piston till March or close so I've got time.
Figured I'd mention this here... I have a couple of comments on my last vid about needing to get a genuine Minarelli engine because the clones have so many tolerance issues that cause problems that I'm having. I can imagine benefits, but I still don't know that I buy into this idea.
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pewpew
Scoot Enthusiast
Posts: 254
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Post by pewpew on Jan 19, 2021 11:02:29 GMT -5
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