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Post by aeroxbud on Jul 18, 2022 4:52:22 GMT -5
I've just replaced my bearings. My stem had a rubber seal below the lower race. It didn't stop the lower bearing from getting trashed though. But when I compared it to the replacement seal. It had shrunk quite a bit.
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Post by 90GTVert on Jul 18, 2022 8:36:04 GMT -5
I'm getting nowhere trying to find a lower dust cover/cap/seal. I tried looking at scooter parts sites for E-Ton and Adly that have parts diagrams. They either don't show lower seals at all or don't carry them. Even if they do, no idea what size they are. I can get a Zuma lower seal, but it prob won't fit and it'll take a couple of weeks. I've done lots of googles. I tried looking for rough dimensions for dust caps/seals.
ATM, the best idea I've got is to buy a regular shaft seal that matches the ID (27mm). I'd have to guess at OD. OD of the frame is 48mm, but the seal OD is for a bore that it should fit. I don't want to match the 43mm bore because the seal would then run into the lower race and not accomplish anything. Guessing maybe a 27x50-52 could work.... but there's only 51mm between the steering stops. Maybe a 25mm ID. Prob doesn't matter too much, because there's no room to put it in there without pushing the lower race up so I'll have to cut out the actual seal in the center. Kinda half-assed, but maybe better than nothing. There's a boss below the bearing area, but that's 37mm OD.
EDIT : Ordered a 37x52 seal and 25x52 seal so I can see which looks like the best option. I can probably take enough off of the steering stops to fit the 52mm seals without much consequence if needed. Ordered 2 bearing kits from ScooterTuning.Ca and a couple of Malossi fuel filters.
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Post by 90GTVert on Jul 19, 2022 17:52:15 GMT -5
I took the fork tubes out and knocked the rust off of the steering stem with wire wheels and sandpaper. It's off so I might as well. I primed and painted it and it's currently in a damp oven (garage).
I think I'm gonna cut the fork springs a little while it's apart as well. The spacers in there are something like 3/4" to 1" so now I'm debating whether I should just cut that much off and see what happens or cut about that much off and make longer spacers. If the stiffening is effective, it would go back to basically stock travel before binding with the current spacers but I should be eliminating some pre-load and making it easy to install the caps again.
I also need to look up what I should cut. These are progressive, so one end is tightly wound (soft) and the other has a wider pitch (stiffer). I can reason this out multiple ways that sound correct to me. One, I could cut the soft end and get rid of some of that soft stuff and stiffen it up on that end, which maybe reduces how much it sags with weight. Two, I could cut the stiffer end and stiffen that more. I think cutting the stiffer side would be correct to stiffen it overall because that would do the most to the overall spring rate. I guess I could cut 1/2 off of each end to change both parts a bit, but that sounds like extra work.
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Post by 190mech on Jul 19, 2022 18:39:34 GMT -5
No seals at all in the 70-80's dirt bikes,they held up well..The crowd that liked shiny dirt bikes would pressure wash them all the time and kill all the bearings including head bearings! Cut the tight coils and fab a spacer for the cut length..
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Post by 90GTVert on Jul 19, 2022 23:12:59 GMT -5
No seals at all in the 70-80's dirt bikes,they held up well..The crowd that liked shiny dirt bikes would pressure wash them all the time and kill all the bearings including head bearings! No worries there! T2 never gets a bath... aside from a couple of trips through the car wash for fun. Still, I think a seal isn't a bad idea if it works. The bottom one is clearly full of dirt and gritty while the top is nice and clean. Even if it doesn't really seal, just keeping a little debris out would be nice.
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Post by Lucass2T on Jul 20, 2022 8:00:03 GMT -5
Sorry i might've missed something. You're talking head bearings/steering stem bearings and dust seals for those? Is that really a thing? Or are you talking fork leg seals/dust caps?
If its the first one? Who uses dust caps for head bearings? I've seen the mx guys put a donut shaped piece of oiled up sponge around the bearing area to keep dust away.
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Post by 90GTVert on Jul 20, 2022 8:23:07 GMT -5
Sorry i might've missed something. You're talking head bearings/steering stem bearings and dust seals for those? Is that really a thing? Or are you talking fork leg seals/dust caps? If its the first one? Who uses dust caps for head bearings? I've seen the mx guys put a donut shaped piece of oiled up sponge around the bearing area to keep dust away. Head/steering stem bearings. My small scoots mostly have a metal cap at the top to cover most of the area and the bottom is open. The TMAX is sealed top and bottom and that looks brand new every time I've had it apart, which annoys me even more when looking at these. I don't see why it's so hard to at least cover both from the factory, but these are Chinese scoots.
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Post by aeroxbud on Jul 20, 2022 14:54:32 GMT -5
Sorry i might've missed something. You're talking head bearings/steering stem bearings and dust seals for those? Is that really a thing? Or are you talking fork leg seals/dust caps? If its the first one? Who uses dust caps for head bearings? I've seen the mx guys put a donut shaped piece of oiled up sponge around the bearing area to keep dust away. My aerox had a dust seal on the bottom. Still didn't stop the bottom bearing looking like this.
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Post by Lucass2T on Jul 20, 2022 15:09:37 GMT -5
Sorry i might've missed something. You're talking head bearings/steering stem bearings and dust seals for those? Is that really a thing? Or are you talking fork leg seals/dust caps? If its the first one? Who uses dust caps for head bearings? I've seen the mx guys put a donut shaped piece of oiled up sponge around the bearing area to keep dust away. My aerox had a dust seal on the bottom. Still didn't stop the bottom bearing looking like this. Thats actually quite cool to kwow! I've literally never seen dust caps on head bearings before. Do you happen to have a pic of it? Worked on millions of Aerox's being a certified scoot mechanic and working as such in a shop. Encountering an untouched aerox is like encountering an untouched VW golf (for the US ppl, an untouched Foxbody mustang). You get the picture...
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Post by 90GTVert on Jul 20, 2022 16:45:58 GMT -5
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Post by oldgeek on Jul 20, 2022 18:37:13 GMT -5
Thats a beefy looking mofo!
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Post by repherence2 on Jul 20, 2022 22:57:25 GMT -5
do you think the Subframe Stretch kit Easyboost +9.5cm from Sc00tertuning would suit your needs? since you asked about info on stretching minarelli bikes, i did some searching to see what George from Motosource here on Oahu had and the only stretched bike i seen was a Rexy and it looks like it has an Easyboost kit on it. most stretched jogs on the internet are for drag racing and they don't have rear shocks. this video has neat set up, basically a custom engine mount. when i first started modifying my Chinarelli, i wanted to stretch it because i seen quite a bit of Hondas on the street with stretch kits. i asked the mechanic at Motosource about stretching my Chinarelli and he said that the way the owner (George) would do it was to move the frame mounts by cutting the welds and moving the mount further back on the frame and welding it back to the frame. it ends up being a stretch and drop. i never asked George about it because he refused to work on Chinarelli bikes, he only worked on Jogs, Rexys, Piaggios, and Benellis. he sold me parts and gave me tuning advice and helped me troubleshoot by conversation but from a business perspective, he did not like the quality of the Chinarelli bikes. this bike looks like the frame mount was moved and customized. i thinks it's Philippines.
the frame mounts on this jog is pretty neat too.
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Post by repherence2 on Jul 20, 2022 23:42:14 GMT -5
Suspension/Engine Mount View : youtu.be/OMSlyfR7HOsIf the spring on the right side looks wrong; I just stuck a random spring in there for a visual. Original was missing.
thank you for making that video. i have the same exact pogo thingy (sub frame) on my Ningbo GTX. from watching the video at 0.25 speed, it looks like the pogo thingy functions like a "torque control", or damper, or in essence a wheelie preventer. the way it articulates under load makes me think that it dampens the torque to minimize the front end from lifting up when the power comes on hard and fast. seems like it was designed to be like a driveability thingy to function like a wheelie/traction controller. it looks like if it was not able to pogo, it would immediately want to pick the front end up. it would seem dangerous to me to have a bike handle like that on a track, as in the bike just always doing power wheelies when you get on the throttle coming out of a turn.
maybe you can do a test by "bypassing" the pogo thingy. from the video, looks like there is about 2 inches of travel until the spring/pogo cups bottom out on the frame. maybe 2 bolts about 3 inches long that can fit into the spring cups of the pogo thingy and use 2 jam nuts to set the bolt head at 2 inches from the top of the spring cup on the pogo thiny. **use the bolt heads to bottom out on the frame stop to prevent the subframe from articulating.** in essence, it will bypass or nullify the pogo action. from the looks of the Easyboost stretch subframe, it looks like that assembly bypasses the pogo/spring assembly.
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Post by 90GTVert on Jul 22, 2022 18:48:23 GMT -5
maybe you can do a test by "bypassing" the pogo thingy. from the video, looks like there is about 2 inches of travel until the spring/pogo cups bottom out on the frame. maybe 2 bolts about 3 inches long that can fit into the spring cups of the pogo thingy and use 2 jam nuts to set the bolt head at 2 inches from the top of the spring cup on the pogo thiny. **use the bolt heads to bottom out on the frame stop to prevent the subframe from articulating.** in essence, it will bypass or nullify the pogo action. from the looks of the Easyboost stretch subframe, it looks like that assembly bypasses the pogo/spring assembly.
That's the plan. 49ccscoot.proboards.com/thread/520/make-minarelli-engine-mount-adjustable
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Post by 90GTVert on Jul 23, 2022 7:13:45 GMT -5
I got the front end wrapped up yesterday. I ended up using the 37x52x8 seal for the lower bearing. There's a raised area just below where the race goes that it fits around. I had to cut out the actual sealing lip on the inside though. It's too tall otherwise. So basically the seal is turned into more of a cap or cup. It's just the right thickness that the bearing race holds it very snug once installed by sandwiching it between the race and the stem, but it doesn't prevent the race from going all the way on. Fitting that way, sealing against the center would seem unnecessary. It's a very snug fit around the frame. It sits at an angle though, because the clamping part of the stem that the seal sits on is angled slightly relative to the shaft. That means it's covering more in some areas, but it does at least cover all the way around. The seal adds some small amount of friction when turning. With just the stem installed, I was afraid it may be an issue. Once I got the weight of the bars and the forks and wheels added, it didn't seem like a big deal. Felt good to me on a test ride. I know it's not common to seal here, but I think it's a good thing. Even if this isn't incredibly effective, less dirt/dust/debris is still better. The spring cutting didn't seem to make a major change, but I think it sags a little less with my weight on the scoot.
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