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Post by scooternub on Jul 15, 2015 9:15:46 GMT -5
I would ask to check if where the flywheel lines up to TDC is indeed TDC. If it is, reinstall the cam so it's marks line up when the flywheel is at the T mark for TDC. so by stock, how did it run? if the T does not tdc?
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Post by scooternub on Jul 15, 2015 9:29:59 GMT -5
Logic tells us you need to go leaner.What size was your stock jet? not sure. stock is a #70.
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Post by Availien on Jul 15, 2015 10:09:50 GMT -5
The cam holes will always ensure that the valves are not engaged. The holes are in sync with the lifters on the cam. You can install the cam completely wrong (as far as timing goes) and line those holes up and it will always be like that. To make sure it's RIGHT though, the flywheel needs to be at the T mark (unless someone has taken the flywheel off and changed its position).
In other words, you can turn the flywheel to the complete opposite side of the T mark, install the cam with the two small holes lined up with the valve head (big hole perpendicular to head surface) and the valves will be free/closed/disengaged. The scooter will not run like this though.
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Post by frank50e on Jul 15, 2015 20:49:14 GMT -5
Sounds suspicuosly like your cam timing is incorrect.I would take it back and personally observe the alignment sounds like you understand how it should be.Then we'll get into jetting.If cam timings off attempting to jet is a waste of time.
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Post by scooternub on Jul 16, 2015 15:47:33 GMT -5
i rejetted the carb to a #90. wasnt that hard.
did not help with top end speed. still at 33mph.
next step is readjust the valves.
see if that helps. i do know he used .006 of an ich rather the .003 and .004. on the valves.
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Post by Availien on Jul 16, 2015 16:10:45 GMT -5
Check the cam timing while you're at it! Put the flywheel on T mark and see where the holes are in the cam. If they don't line up, it's probably not right.
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Post by frank50e on Jul 16, 2015 21:11:25 GMT -5
Someone should have brought this up earlier but since you told us you observed your ace mechanic not adjusting the valve timing properly I would take it back and have him do it right before adjusting valves,rejetting,or passing go.You paid him.But I will tell you this,if it was our shop and my partner or I had done the work,I would tell you I would gladly pull the covers and show you my work and if I had erred I'd refund your labor charge for your trouble.However if my work was accurate it would cost you shop min. which at our place is 50 bucks.Times money for a wrench.
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Post by scooternub on Jul 17, 2015 8:07:14 GMT -5
Someone should have brought this up earlier but since you told us you observed your ace mechanic not adjusting the valve timing properly I would take it back and have him do it right before adjusting valves,rejetting,or passing go.You paid him.But I will tell you this,if it was our shop and my partner or I had done the work,I would tell you I would gladly pull the covers and show you my work and if I had erred I'd refund your labor charge for your trouble.However if my work was accurate it would cost you shop min. which at our place is 50 bucks.Times money for a wrench. i observed only 20 minutes then left. i just dropped it off at his shop this morning. he is gonna readjust the valves. and find out why T is not TDC.
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Post by Availien on Jul 17, 2015 8:53:55 GMT -5
I would literally bet on it not being timed right.
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Post by frank50e on Jul 17, 2015 13:11:00 GMT -5
I will take it back. and explain to him, whats going on. As far as what I know, from reading here. What was odd was is that, when he took the valve cover off, I watched him during this process, he turned the crank shaft till valves were both free from contact from the arms. Which took the cam shaft holes three lined up. I asked him to check the fly wheel, see if it was on the T mark "TDC". It was off. Turned the fly wheel to the T mark, now the cam shaft holes were diagonal. So he went with his expertise not going by the fly wheel TDC, but by lifters being free of contact of the arms and I seen the 3 holes on the cam line up when he did this process. Oh yea, he used a special marker and marked the timing chain and cam. For this I have no idea whats really going on.
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Post by frank50e on Jul 17, 2015 13:14:09 GMT -5
Pretty clear IMO
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Post by scooternub on Jul 18, 2015 12:47:15 GMT -5
I will take it back. and explain to him, whats going on. As far as what I know, from reading here. What was odd was is that, when he took the valve cover off, I watched him during this process, he turned the crank shaft till valves were both free from contact from the arms. Which took the cam shaft holes three lined up. I asked him to check the fly wheel, see if it was on the T mark "TDC". It was off. Turned the fly wheel to the T mark, now the cam shaft holes were diagonal. So he went with his expertise not going by the fly wheel TDC, but by lifters being free of contact of the arms and I seen the 3 holes on the cam line up when he did this process. Oh yea, he used a special marker and marked the timing chain and cam. For this I have no idea whats really going on. he rechecked it. T is indeed tdc. also he advanced the cam by a tooth and retarded. ran like crap he said. so timing is fine.
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Post by Availien on Jul 18, 2015 14:18:24 GMT -5
he rechecked it. T is indeed tdc. also he advanced the cam by a tooth and retarded. ran like crap he said. so timing is fine. What's going on here?
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Post by spaz12 on Jul 19, 2015 16:46:51 GMT -5
I will take it back. and explain to him, whats going on. As far as what I know, from reading here. What was odd was is that, when he took the valve cover off, I watched him during this process, he turned the crank shaft till valves were both free from contact from the arms. Which took the cam shaft holes three lined up. I asked him to check the fly wheel, see if it was on the T mark "TDC". It was off. Turned the fly wheel to the T mark, now the cam shaft holes were diagonal. So he went with his expertise not going by the fly wheel TDC, but by lifters being free of contact of the arms and I seen the 3 holes on the cam line up when he did this process. Oh yea, he used a special marker and marked the timing chain and cam. For this I have no idea whats really going on. he rechecked it. T is indeed tdc. also he advanced the cam by a tooth and retarded. ran like crap he said. so timing is fine. If your "mechanic" really did "advance the timing by a tooth", then he is a Special Kind Of Stupid.
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Post by frank50e on Jul 19, 2015 17:26:01 GMT -5
My question is why do either? But what I find really astonishing is after being told his work resulted in a dramatic drop in performance, when that is the opposite effect it should have had, he let it back out of his shop. That gentlemen to me does not resonate reputable.
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