brainpup
Scoot Member
63 Years Young and still love to ride every day
Posts: 24
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Post by brainpup on May 29, 2018 9:40:10 GMT -5
I'm not sure what to do next 3 weeks ago I swapped out my air box for a cone like filter (generic K&N) and my Taotao EVO 150 ran great for a day, and now she will not start...just for sheets and giggles I went back to the air box, no luck. So I replaced all of the vacuum hoses and fuel lines, new filter, new petcock, new gas and finally a whole new Keihin carburetor, intake manifold and air filter...no luck... I have a fully charged battery, a proven working CDI ( I actually have = 2 stock Black ones, 2 Orange ones, 3 Blue ones and a Purple adjustable one that have all been tested in a different scooter). I have 2 Stock coils and one Orange one (that was working just fine for the last year) . I have a new NGK plug, 2 good but slightly used 3 prong plugs and a couple of used but good NGK's. still no luck with starting. I do have Spark...as I can see it when I lay the plug on the head and crank it, how strong it is I have no way to tell, but I can see it. Yesterday I pulled the plug back out and stuck my finger over the hole, theres definitely compression, again how strong I don't know as I don't have a compression gauge... And even thought I just bought a brand new carb, how can I really tell if I am getting gas to the plug ? should my finger have gotten wet when I stuck it over the hole and cranked the motor ? I adjusted the idle screw from barely touching the stop, in 1½ turns....but I didn't mess with the factory set "air mixture screw"...In is lean, Out is rich ? How can I measure how much Spark I am getting ? cause I mean I can see the spark going back and forth when I am cranking her but it just doesn't look that strong... oh and I did the TDC check, by putting a probe in the plug hole and got the piston to the top and then checked my flywheel mark and it was right on the spot. What else can I do ?
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Post by 90GTVert on May 29, 2018 13:09:09 GMT -5
An easy way to see if it's got a decent spark is to use an old plug and either bend the ground strap way back (like straight up) or break or cut the strap off. Then use that for a tester. If it will jump that with a blue/white/violet spark, then spark strength is likely alright. If it cranks and cranks and never starts, usually the plug will have some evidence of raw fuel on it. You can also put a few drops of gas or a quick burst of starting fluid/carb cleaner/brake cleaner in the plug hole and then replace the plug and try to crank it. I often put an unlit propane torch in the airbox inlet or mouth of the carb to provide some fuel to see if it will start. The mix screw on that carb should control fuel, so turning it in shuts off supply and leans it out and turning it out opens the passage and richens. If you aren't getting fuel, you may wanna make sure the vacuum petcock is working. Most will just test it by taking the vacuum hose off of the intake and sucking on the hose to see if fuel flows out of the petcock then. I personally don't test any of mine because I toss them in the garbage can and convert to manual shutoff valves so I have one less potential common point of failure.
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Post by tortoise2 on May 29, 2018 15:11:12 GMT -5
Per clone thread . . . "my engine has never had a valve adjustment, unless it happened during the 1st 1000 km, before I got the bike...now shes at 12,000 km"
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brainpup
Scoot Member
63 Years Young and still love to ride every day
Posts: 24
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Post by brainpup on May 29, 2018 15:44:34 GMT -5
Hello Mr. 90GTVert and Hi again to Mr. tortoise2, I have pulled the hose off the fuel out side of the Petcock and turned the engine over and fuel flies out right away...(it's a brand new Petcock and I used new clear fuel lines.so it's easy to see the fuel going into my brand new carb. I even used an eye dropper and shot fuel directly into the plug hole, reinstalled the plug and tried...it made a small back fire sound, but did not start...I tried 3 times..no luck at actually starting. I have actually drained all of the old gas out (while I was replacing all of the gas & vacuum hoses & fuel filter ) and put fresh gas in. ...and yes tortoise2 I have not had a valve job done, but my scooter was running just fine the day it died, with plenty of power & acceleration, and at least 50 mph with a nice even quiet idle of about 1800 rpm, so it wasn't like she started losing power slowly or bogging down on me. She would kick start on 1 or 2 kicks or instantly on the electric starter so there had to be good compression.
I can't understand how just all of sudden it just won't start. I've had dozens of scooter and several 2 stroke mopeds, and have always been able to find a way to get them started, even if just for a minute on starter fluid, but not this beast !! I swear if one of you were close (Charlotte) I'd give ya 50 bucks to get it started right now...
any other suggestions ? could my stator not be putting out enuf juice ?
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Post by 90GTVert on May 29, 2018 15:53:58 GMT -5
If you check the spark as I mentioned, that would tell you if the whole iggy is putting out enough.
At 12,000km it's past time to check those valves anyway. Really is something you should consider as a maintenance item even if you don't think it will help now. Great thing about a valve check is that if they are indeed spot on, it's easy enough. You can just put the valve cover back on.
Backfiring makes me think timing, but that gets more complex. I would honestly start with the valve adjustment myself. As I said, it should be done now and sometimes it will cause a hard start or no start condition. Might as well get that out of the way IMO, for both the maintenance and the troubleshooting. 0.002" intake and 0.003" exhaust is what I commonly use.
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brainpup
Scoot Member
63 Years Young and still love to ride every day
Posts: 24
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Post by brainpup on May 29, 2018 16:08:24 GMT -5
Hey guys, there is one thing that is different that I forgot to mention, NOW without my Stock Air Box, the "breather hose" that comes out from the top of the valve cover, has no where to go. neither does the "breather hose" from my CVT case. They used to plug into the "snorkel" hose on my air box...now they just hang on top of my rear fender. Should they go some where else ? I also no longer have a vacuum hose going to the connection on the "PAIR/EGR. Here's a pic tracing those breather hoses and a circle around the vacuum hose that is no longer there.
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Post by killt704 on Jun 4, 2018 23:03:22 GMT -5
Hey man I recently had a similar issue myself. It just wouldn't start and would kill my battery turning over. Had good compression good spark(after fixing the timing which was off a tooth or two.) after correcting the timing it ended up being that and the old fuel lines and filter. I gravity feed mine so no petcock but after changing out the hoses it started right up and has run well since. I'm now just dealing with some electrical issues. Good luck man.
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Post by lilpinny on Jun 12, 2018 22:35:10 GMT -5
Hey guys, there is one thing that is different that I forgot to mention, NOW without my Stock Air Box, the "breather hose" that comes out from the top of the valve cover, has no where to go. neither does the "breather hose" from my CVT case. They used to plug into the "snorkel" hose on my air box...now they just hang on top of my rear fender. Should they go some where else ? I also no longer have a vacuum hose going to the connection on the "PAIR/EGR. Here's a pic tracing those breather hoses and a circle around the vacuum hose that is no longer there. The breathers can just run to the open air. Just put them somewhere out of the way. They are just there in case there is too much oil it's got a place to go. Your old system recycled it.
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Post by lilpinny on Jun 12, 2018 22:44:03 GMT -5
I thought that when you block the pair you have a couple of ports that you just put little air filters on so nothing gets in there.
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brainpup
Scoot Member
63 Years Young and still love to ride every day
Posts: 24
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Post by brainpup on Jun 16, 2018 16:05:33 GMT -5
Hey lilpinny and killt704 I appreciate the suggestions and I have now done a valve adjustment to no avail ( well I think I did it right ) .004" intake-.006" exhaust.....but all I get is rurrururrururur and no starting, and I double checked spark and it's there, I have no way of telling if its enuf though.... I swear right now I am so frustrated...any body near Charlotte, NC I got a little money left I can give ya for some help
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Post by lilpinny on Jun 16, 2018 16:08:09 GMT -5
GY6 1 - brainpup 0
Don't let it beat you. Is your engine ground good? Check that with a multimeter. Also, are you using starting fluid? If not go get some.
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Post by lilpinny on Jun 16, 2018 16:11:47 GMT -5
When I try to start mine after its been sitting it usually takes me two days to get it running. The first day it fires and builds upntue vaccum then inkillntue battery. I out it on the charger overnifht and try again and it fires up. Use starting fluid... Just a couple of sprays in the carb so it gets the vapor.
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brainpup
Scoot Member
63 Years Young and still love to ride every day
Posts: 24
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Post by brainpup on Jun 16, 2018 16:21:32 GMT -5
Matter of fact I checked my ground, when I 1st started trouble shooting stuff like my coil and my CDI, all good. My scoot was not "sitting" when it just stopped starting, it all happened right after swapped out my airbox for a K&N like cone filter...it did start that afternoon and I ran around the apt complex a little and all was great, then the next morning, varoom varoom and I was out and about...stopped 2 times at store & bank then to my manager's office and then she would not start again. I paid $40 to get her home and then put the air box back on, still would not start. I've replaced everything under the dam sun, gone thru a whole can of starter fluid too. She has always ran great...other than my timing being off or the valve adjustment I did, the only thing else I can think of is if my stator is just not puttin out enuf juice.
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Post by killt704 on Jun 16, 2018 16:24:29 GMT -5
Have you replaced your fuel lines and vacuum lines? Or checked them atleast? Seems like it's gotta be a fuel issue if u have spark
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Post by lilpinny on Jun 16, 2018 16:24:43 GMT -5
Ok. So there has been a lot of change that we need to walk back.
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