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Post by harleyracer59 on Sept 27, 2018 19:18:10 GMT -5
Im not sure what the deal is, but when I take the gyro out for a spin and park it, the oil injection tank cap has popped out and I have oil in the little spill tray under cap. its injecting oil just fine. theres only 1 line attached to it and it goes to the pump where I can see flow. ive had to connect a hose tro the spill tray and route it down between the tires to keep mit from dripping down the fairings and onto the tire. its like the oil is carbinated. which I know its not. lol anyone have any thoughts or ideas? ive even swapped the cap with both my aero caps. works fine on them and whatever cap goes on the gyro pops out. at least the seat keeps it in its area so I don't loose it while riding. thanks
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Post by ThaiGyro on Sept 27, 2018 20:03:41 GMT -5
Not any good ones. Unless there is a way, after engine shuts off, that case pressure/gasses are leaching back to the tank. I only premix, but we have some Gyro friends who still pump oil. Will ask around. WE have very few NN50's here, but the setup must be similar.
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Post by gsx600racer on Sept 27, 2018 23:31:32 GMT -5
My only guess is if the oil pump seals maybe leaking and forcing pressure from the crankcase up thru the injection oil feed line and into the tank. But if that was the case it would also be pushing oil back into the reservoir and that wouldn't be a good thing. Plus the check valve is on the line between the pump and the carb.
I'v had the opposite case with CL scooter where the previous owner used a taper expanding plug to seal off the filler. With no vent in the cap and vacuum built up in the reservoir and the engine eventually starved of oil and seized.
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Post by harleyracer59 on Sept 28, 2018 6:03:25 GMT -5
yeah I'm not sure either. the pump looks exactly like a dio, af05, ab07 (honda) pump. I forgot about the check valve, my express's check ball spring got weak and would let oil by when sitting and smoke like a mother if it sat a week or so. this isn't like that. also I remember reading somewhere that the horizontal gyro oil pump was on the non vacuum side of the case, (other side of seal.) and I have a clear hose from pump to manifold and switched from a blueish color oil to red. I can see that the oil is flowing the correct way, plus I've put 15-20 miles on it while having this issue. it happens while riding. When its not running the catch tray will stay clean. And stay clean till I ride again. when I get somewhere and lift the seat its got a puddle in the catch tray and cap is popped up. like there was carbonation in the oil. it leaks/ over flows when shaken. lol I thought it was over filled but that wasn't the case. it does spill less the lover the level is though. so I've been keeping it about a 1/2" above the low oil light sensor level. tired of the mess and don't like wasting oil. its got me stumped. gotta be something though. just cant think of it.  thanks for the ideas. all are welcome. |
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Post by ThaiGyro on Sept 30, 2018 7:02:43 GMT -5
Harley, have you taken a sample of the "carbonated" oil when you find it? Maybe it will give a clue. Draw a sample into a glass beaker with vent...like making beer! Let it sit a see of it separates...  This would work, but you only need a small cylinder. Pre fill the bubbler with water at 50%...put sample in and immediately plug with stopper/bubbler. Maybe? |
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Post by harleyracer59 on Sept 30, 2018 17:16:14 GMT -5
that's a damn good idea! I might just drain the wqhole tank into a jug and see what happens when I let it sit a week. ill do this today. thanks for the idea!!
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Post by ThaiGyro on Oct 2, 2018 2:52:37 GMT -5
I only suggest the bubbler to see if there is excess vapors being vented...gasoline in the crankcase or??
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Post by harleyracer59 on Oct 8, 2018 15:17:27 GMT -5
update: drained the tank, no contaminates in the oil. I did find a small hose barb on the crank case next to carb and oil pump. it had a hose attached that was bent and aimed down like a drain. the fitting has pressure coming from the case 100% of the time. I removed hose because it looked like it was pinched. I think this solved the issue. I need to put some more miles on it to be sure but it has seemed to stop popping the cap off oil tank.
the hose wasn't capped or blocked completely by the bend? pinched line either. while investigating I reinstalled it and it had pressure at the end but nowhere close to the pressure coming directly from the fitting itself.
weird thing I cant figure out is the pump was pumping oil, ive seen no bubbles in the clear lines to and from oil pump.
so how was the pressure transferred to the tank? if this line is the culprit? ill try and snap a pic of it and maybe hook a gauge up to it for a pressure reading for show and tell. lol and update this with any findings.
maybe TG can ask his buddies if they know of or what this fitting is for? nothing similar on any of my other Hondas except my af18 motor, and that's vacuum for the fuel pump I believe. my gyro line has no vacuum and no fuel pump and no vacuum operated petcock. ?
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Post by gsx600racer on Oct 9, 2018 0:52:28 GMT -5
 Will be interesting to see what the culprit is/was. |
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Post by ThaiGyro on Oct 10, 2018 10:07:09 GMT -5
Okay...no hose barb on any Gyro we have seen. My OEM setup had a simple vacuum pump to draw fuel...and a separate oil line from the crank driven pump from the ugly oil tank. The oil line was quite normal...going in at the elbow just after the carb. Pre-mixing eliminated the old cracked lines and issues.
I gravity feed, with a diaphragm carb...or without. No pump on the Del'Orto, as the tank I built is above everything, but not under the seat...so no need. A Gyro UP has a rear deck...it IS the front part of that deck. The outlet is near where the old pump used to be.
Looks like you will find out soon! Keep replacing lines and look for cracks. Remember CRACK kills!
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Post by harleyracer59 on Oct 11, 2018 19:07:39 GMT -5
yeah these horizontal gyro motors are odd ducks... 3 bolt intakes and such. I've put a few more miles on it since. there's a little bit of residue in the over fill trough but nothing like before. I keep forgetting to snap a pic of this mystery barb. ill go do it right now and post a pic.
craziest part is I saw no air bubbles traveling up the oil feed line. and the hose I pulled off the mystery fitting wasn't clogged by any stretch, just looked a little restricted in the bend.
ive seen crack kill. whitney huston rip... first thing I usually do when I get another scooter is replace the lines, oil and fuel. and I like running clear hoses for the obvious reason a quick look will let you know everything is doing what it should. im still oil injected on all my scoots. I wish I could put an oil pump and tank on my 66cc beach cruiser motor. it just simplifies things
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Post by harleyracer59 on Oct 14, 2018 11:53:21 GMT -5
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Will be interesting to see what the culprit is/was. 
