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Post by 90GTVert on Aug 16, 2015 15:53:47 GMT -5
That sort of stuff shouldn't be happening on a scoot with all sorts of work done to it that I believe you said had a PDI. If someone really did a PDI and didn't leave things loose, you may have had a different experience. There's no reason for things to be left loose when you know they had to be messed with to get in there and do the BBK. Stuff happens and we all make mistakes, but personally if I gave a customer one scoot that immediately had a leak from carelessness, I'd wanna be real careful with the next one. I'd prob be fed up too in your situation.
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Post by Fox on Aug 16, 2015 17:03:44 GMT -5
I have been sitting here thinking about what could possibly happen on a rough patch of road that would cause the engine to die and the only thing I can think of is that the carburetor partially popped out of the intake boot causing a vac leak at the intake or a vacuum line cracked.
Then another part of me is thinking that the rough road was just coincidentally where the BBK decided to give out and one had nothing to do with the other. Like a clip popped out of the piston and it gouged the cylinder wall really bad or a valve adjuster loosened up and got really sloppy and again, the rough road had nothing to do with it.
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Post by derbiman on Aug 16, 2015 17:14:28 GMT -5
Sounds like a lot of incompetent people may have had their hands on it. They didn't do a proper PDI on the first scooter and it sounds as though the may have bypassed a lot of things on the second one also. Who knows,maybe the jets fell out of the carb and are at the bottom of the bowl. Lol
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Post by paulmohr on Aug 16, 2015 17:40:08 GMT -5
Yes Brent that is how I feel. I understand you guys normally get yours for a good price and the show up as a box of parts you have to assemble and check everything over. However these scooters are pre assembled off from a show room floor with upgraded parts like carbs, hoses and stuff like that. Leaking valve covers, loose throttle cables and stuff like that just don't sit well with me. Especially when they kept the second one an extra week so they could "go over it with a fine tooth comb". If I was the owner of this shop I would be pissed. I would also consider dropping some of the cheaper models and just carry the better ones if only to improve my reputation.
I guess that is why no one near me locally carries these kind of scooters. The only thing you see in local motorcycle shops are honda's and yamaha. I looked at an original yamaha and they wanted 2500 for it. I can get one of the classic honda models for around 1900 though. Or I think the Grom was just under 3 grand. 60 bucks a month if you financed it. But the Grom is a motorcycle, all be it a tiny one. Its a 125, is a 4 speed manual and goes over 35 mile an hour. So you have to get plates, insurance and a motorcycle permit on your license. I don't mind getting the permit, you can take a class that is actually kind of fun and it assures your permit. Its the insurance I don't want to pay.
A Hoyt target bow is starting to look better and better to me lol.
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Post by twowheelinjim on Aug 16, 2015 23:19:22 GMT -5
I don't post often but you caught my interest. I realize there are a bunch of unscrupulous scooter dealers out there but there are far more that are honest and genuinely want to provide excellent customer service. its like anything else in life. My advise to you is to take this scooter and make it right and make it your own. It's a challenge. Make it a personal challenge. In the evenings I run a scooter shop as a way to supplement my income and as a way to stay occupied. I face some serious issues daily and some days I get overwhelmed with the most complex repairs one could imagine. Am I crazy? No. I just believe in myself. I'll tell you the secret..Have confidence in yourself and don't let the little problems stump you. And, they are all little problems. We fear the unknown. Prepare yourself by gaining knowledge through asking questions from these fine ladies and gentlemen here on the forum. Consider the scooter itself as a metaphor. Its a stepping stone to other greater things that you will experience in life. If you overcome this obstacle, it will change your life. You will be enlightened. I know it sounds like crazy hippy talk but at least think about it. Make this a positive experience.
You might've just knocked a vacuum line loose on the new scooter...I just fixed a brand new Zuma clone with the same problems you experienced. Simple.
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Post by birdman on Aug 17, 2015 3:02:57 GMT -5
Yah we do love our scoots! Sorry to hear about your bad experience- like mentioned they aren't for everyone! I have posted this vid b4 but I thought it'd be worth another post! If you're thinking about a grom this might just hook ya! Let us know if u get one! This vid alone makes me want one! (These r modified btw). Holy crap! What kind of scooters are those? Yes, I realize they are modded but they sounded like 4 strokers to me. I worked on my scoot most of the day but now I can see I have a long way to go, ha ha. Bill Those are Honda Grom. 125cc over priced 4speed motorcycle. I cant wait to run into one of these slow pieces of junk on my 70cc elite, I will smoke that tthing. Also look at that guys body angle... Turning left with a knee down yet he is leaning right, meaning there is no need for him to take a knee. If he leaned his body to tge inside of the turn he could make the same radius with less lean angle. The grom is ghey, plain and simple. Also every a/m part is rediculously over priced... Think "ruckus2.0". I cant wait to embarras some clown on a grom. |
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Post by frank50e on Aug 17, 2015 9:53:05 GMT -5
I can't speak on the Grom I am not familiar with it.But Birdman has it nailed,Honda is in love with their parts.If you want a reliable 50cc scoot for around the money you spent that will be as fast or faster than your tuned 4t,good used Zuma and Vino's are out there'They will run forever with minimal maintainence.Takes some patience to find a good used one locally but highly recommended.
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Post by frank50e on Aug 17, 2015 9:54:10 GMT -5
2ts that is ,they made both.
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Post by paulmohr on Aug 17, 2015 11:49:40 GMT -5
Well the guy called me this morning and said he would take it back, but I have to get it there. He said he isn't going to keep making trips to adrian every time I have a problem. He basically told me it was a piece of shit and I shouldn't have bought it! I told him every nut and bolt on this thing was loose and he siad "Yep, they do that". Really, after 30 freakin miles?
So I went out to see if I could drain the gas out of it before trying to stuff it into our little mazda suv. Guess what I see. There are no nuts on the carb mount!!!!!WTF. No wonder it wouldn't run, I am shocked it ran for as long as at did. I put the two nuts back on hooked up a battery jumper and it still wouldn't start. Used a little spray start and it finally kicked over. Wouldn't idle for shit though. I messed with the idle set screw and air mixture and got it to idle. Except when I ride it it wants to die when you back off the throttle.
I am thinking either i need to the pull the plug and clean it, or maybe the battery doesn't have enough juice to idle? Would either of those cause it, or should I be looking for something else?
If I can get it to run right again I may just keep it. Just for the fact I don't want to load in the suv and drive all the way to lansing and make the car smell like gas. I also don't want to get in an argument with this guy. Which I am pretty sure will happen if I see him face to face.
Once it starts and you take off it pulls really well and doesn't seem to bog or miss. So I don't think anything serious is wrong with it. Its just gotta be dumb little loose things or something maybe.
Will this battery charge from running the engine, or will I have to get a small charger for it?
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Post by 90GTVert on Aug 17, 2015 11:59:00 GMT -5
If someone does a proper PDI, screws and bolts should not be backing out on the first ride. All of my scooters are Chinese and I'm not leaving a trail of nuts and bolts everywhere I go. These are also fasteners they should have had hands on while doing a BBK, so it points to an inattentive, unconcerned, or unqualified mechanic. Once may be a mistake, but this is the second time now with 2 scoots.
As long as it's an AC CDI (most are) the battery shouldn't prevent it from running. I rode with no battery at all for quite a while on one of mine. The CDI is supplied with power from an exciter coil in the stator. If it's DC your CDI should be very large and it may not even start if you have a low battery and I'd think it would not want to run well at all above idle.
The battery should charge once running, but I highly recommend owning a good charger/maintainer. I have been very pleased with my Battery Tender Jr.
Double check all vacuum connections. Wouldn't hurt to make sure the plug is in good condition and gapped properly... and if you do keep it put an NGK CR7HS ir CR7HIX in there if it's still got a Chinese plug like a Torch as they're known to randomly fail.
If it does end up in an SUV, put some trash bags or a tarp down before the scooter goes in and hopefully any scoot related smells should disappear after riding with the windows down for a bit once the floor coverings are out.
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Post by Fox on Aug 17, 2015 12:03:52 GMT -5
Sounds like they tuned it with a loose intake so the jetting may be off. Did you verify there 's still an o-ring on the intake where it meets the head? It may have fallen out of there on that bumpy road.
Get a trickle charger for it. 1.5 amp
How's the plug look?
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Post by paulmohr on Aug 17, 2015 12:44:38 GMT -5
I haven't pulled the plug yet. I am a bit woozy and out of sorts today. I think arguing with him on the phone this morning may have done me in for the day. Part of having anxiety problems. Some days I am with it, other days I just can't think straight and get very agitated and dizzy very easily. Probably doesn't help that its hotter then all get out and humid too.
I didn't check the O-ring, I didn't pull it all the way off, I just saw the nuts were missing and pulled a couple off that cheap trunk they put on them. Lucky for me they were the right size. I snugged it back down and tried to see if it would start.
I suppose what I should do is pull all the covers off and just run through everything. Pull the carb off and check the float level and all that. Maybe pull the valve cover off and check the valve lash too.
I would like to think the nuts were on there to begin with. It ran really good to begin with, if it had that big of a leak I wouldn't think it would have ran at all. I rode it for about 5 or 10 miles the one day and didn't have any issues. Sounds like I am going to have buy a big bottle of lock tite for this thing.
He asked me how far away I was when it died and I told him a couple miles. He said I shouldn't be riding it that far. He said these cheap things are only made to ride maybe 5 blocks, not 5 miles. If this thing is a such a cheap pile of crap why did he sell it to me? He knew where I lived and the problems I had with the last one when he agreed to make this deal. If he knew there would be problems he should not have agreed to it. Its not like I begged him to get a cheaper scooter. As a matter of fact I think I said I would agree to it if he could assure me there would not be any more problems. All he had to do was say "I can't promise that, you might as well just get your money back.".
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Post by 90GTVert on Aug 17, 2015 13:09:19 GMT -5
I suppose what I should do is pull all the covers off and just run through everything. Pull the carb off and check the float level and all that. Maybe pull the valve cover off and check the valve lash too. Sounds like I am going to have buy a big bottle of lock tite for this thing. Yes. All of that should be done during a thorough PDI before the scoot ever hits the road IMO. www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLm3-Rt5jsolvEQcIl1CMZGW5Yj_kP4WjcHe asked me how far away I was when it died and I told him a couple miles. He said I shouldn't be riding it that far. He said these cheap things are only made to ride maybe 5 blocks, not 5 miles. Just the rides I've put up vids of, all at least 5hrs straight, many more like 7-9hrs of straight riding. Many more done not on video. TaoTao isn't shown, but it has been over 150 miles in one sitting at all of 30-35MPH WOT most of the time. www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLm3-Rt5jsoltkMD_ANI6SQ7QJ7SkRds8vIf this thing is a such a cheap pile of crap why did he sell it to me? Doesn't seem wise to me for a business owner to give the impression that his products are junk. I would applaud a shop owner that tells a customer realistically that Chinese scooters are not the highest quality and they are likely to be less reliable down the road. That, to me, would be good business and looking out for the customer. In this case it appears to be a matter of pointing the finger anywhere but at him or his employees. On that note, if you are still in some phase of considering your options then let me bring something up. Even if you go through a PDI and get it all sorted out, it will always be a Chinese scooter (short of replacing pretty much everything). Electronics, stock bearings, seals, machine work, etc... are inferior to what you may find on more expensive Japanese and European scooters. You will still be at a greater risk of parts failure/breakdown. Not so much as if no one properly goes over the scooter or if someone leaves fasteners loose, but if you will get upset if it breaks down or needs attention beyond routine maintenance at some point in the relatively near future then you may want to consider other options. I in no way mean to sound as if you can't be a happy Chinese scooter owner. I love mine... at least some of the time. lol They definitely are not the answer for everyone though and you must be willing to work on them or willing to pay someone else to. It is unrealistic to expect them to be trouble free long term. |
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I give up
Aug 17, 2015 14:06:33 GMT -5
via mobile
Post by katastroff on Aug 17, 2015 14:06:33 GMT -5
Get a 2t stock zuma. They can take abuse like you wouldnt believe.
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Post by Fox on Aug 17, 2015 14:07:27 GMT -5
It's obvious you are dealing with an idiot. He's either bullshitting you to point blame away from him and his worthless unqualified service dept. which makes him a rip-off artist like Brent said, or he truly believes what he told you which makes him ignorant and a bad businessman.
True that China scoots are les reliable and don't last as long as a Japanese machine but I took my GY6 50cc Chinese scooter for long rides of 100-200 miles in a single day without a break down so the guy is talking out of his behind.
Even though it didn't come to you in a box, I think a full PDI is in order here due to the obvious incompetence of the service staff over there at Campus Scooter in Lansing Michigan. It's gonna resolve any issues you are having and give you peace of mind knowing that everything was done right. You tend to feel a nice sense of trust/confidence toward your scooter when you turn all the screws and bolts yourself.
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