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Post by 245luigi on Jul 28, 2024 15:45:26 GMT -5
O-ring does seal can confirm.
I also can confirm almost all my times are faster after the decking but not fast enough. What I was seeing was about 4 sec 0-10 mph, 6 sec 0 - 20 mph, 9 sec 0 - 30 mph, 10 sec 0 - 35 mph, 12 sec 0 - 40 mph, and 17 sec 0 - 50 mph.
I do have some kind of bog when I whip the throttle open. I figured I would try tightening the clutch springs (Polini speed clutch) to see if that would get rid of it. I tightened them all a half turn, didnt seem to make much effect at all.
Then when fumbling with the clutch I turned some screws and totally messed up where my setting was (gah unwanted variable). So I just set them all to them same and proceeded. I also installed a Polini speed bell (I was running the stock clutch bell). I can tell it is lighter than stock, same size. I lost my footage so I missed some testing but I can tell the clutch is grabbing at a higher rpm. Still bogging though when whacking open throttle. Is this a consequence of the phbg carb? I can post a clip if needed.
With the unknown clutch setting and speedbell, something funky was going on. I was riding back from my test spot and it felt like the bike was losing power at WOT and revved out. Like giving it the beans but power was not being delivered. At first I was like holy crap soft sieze incoming but my temps were like 310f. Had a theory that it was the clutch bell slipping so I put the stock one back on. Symptom went away. So I was like ok its not trying to soft sieze. Testing my theory I put the speed bell back on and went WOT. Slipping feeling return but I kept it open. Nothing bad happened, temps stayed at 310f and RPMs stayed at 9800k. So I'm thinking now, maybe the CDI is restricted? We have always said the kymco CDI is not restricted but could that be my issue?
The unknown clutch setting and speedbell now also prevent me from even hitting 50 mph. The 9800k hits at about 47 mph and I cant go any faster. I do reach all 0 - 40 times the same as before. The bike just stops at 47 mph. I have clips of this as well. I think maybe the lighter bell is causing me to fly past the usual power band of 8-9.5k rpm and hit some kind of limiter. Thoughts?
As the race is 2 weeks away, I'm thinking go back to the stock clutch bell instead of redial the whole CVT for the new bell.
Is there some kind of universal unrestricted CDI? I count 8 pins in the CDI. I got the Naraku one for my bike back in the day but plugged it in and knew it immediately was a scam. I'll probably try it again before removing the bell.
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Post by 245luigi on Aug 5, 2024 15:47:54 GMT -5
This past weekends testing was a wash. I went back to the stock bell and wanted to get the CVT tuned with the new cylinder. Heard what I thought was a sneeze from the engine after a first test. Engine temps were a little higher than usual and power was down. I thought if might have been the head gasket so took apart the engine. No signs of seizures. Head gasket deforms differently than a non-decked head but still seemed ok. Replaced it and still down on power and higher temps. Kept testing anyways thinking it was some variable I am messing with. Engine vibrations are up and the bike got louder, thought I blew my reeds. Nope, my buddy noticed my exhaust was hanging by literally one nut. Quickly ran to home depot and got loads of hardware (bolt for silencer, two bolts/nuts/washers to mount pipe back to bracket, and a nut for one exhaust stud LOL). Got it all together. It was 9pm at that point. Confirmed power and temps were back. No time for more testing and considered all tests that day invalid (4 different roller setups and test with the Naraku CDI).
So off to the races next weekend. Setup differs from last race 1) new cylinder 2) raised exhaust port 3) decked head 4) unknown clutch setting. Didnt get to adjust CVT. Thats for next year now.
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Post by 245luigi on Aug 18, 2024 0:48:28 GMT -5
Races were rain delayed to September. I was able to do some more tuning. Tried to focus more on the CVT. As of right now I think I really can't get more out of the bike. The CVT really is a balance of top speed and acceleration. Based off my data, I am at the balance point where, lower weights raise 0-50 mph times, higher weights mess with acceleration. I was focused on Brent's 0-35 time at about 8 seconds. I actually could probably hit that with lower weights but then my 0 - 50 mph times would be bad. I threw some 5 gram rollers in and the bike really took off quick but had no good top speed That Elite I'm racing really is a beast because I know that its accel and 0-50 mph times beat mine and I really cant squeeze any more out of the CVT. I know at the end of the straight I was at about 47 mph so I really can't sacrifice the top speed. I may try a race with one set of rollers and see if lighter ones are better in the next race. Get the guys in corners then hope its enough for the straight!
I am running rollers, are sliders worth the swap? Curious if there is another way to get acceleration and some top speed without the CVT. Maybe decking the cylinder (head can't take anymore). Squish is at about 1.28 mm at the moment.
Also, something funky is happening with the bike. It seems like the exhaust constantly wants to shake itself off. The bike doesn't really have any bad vibrations, but I do have some kind of resonance that I hit at like 9 - 9.3k rpm. Its not bad though. I never had to use any Loctite on any of the exhaust components but after decking and raising the port, it seems like after almost any run, I've lost some exhaust bolt e.g. one that holds the silencer spring or the stud nuts have worked themselves loose. I have Loctited everything now, its just so strange though.
I also think I have some reed valve flutter at higher rpm. Best I can describe the sound is a bunch of vhs tape being slapped down hard on a table. Reeds are carbon fiber made by me. I inspected them today and they look fine.
Another thing I need to figure out is the bog off the line. Whacking the throttle open, the bike needs about a second to catch up. Seems to happen no matter what the clutch setting is. But it seemed to go away when I slapped some low weight (not usable) rollers in. Not sure about this one.
Sorry guys a bit all over the place. Tuning is fun!
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Post by broyager on Aug 19, 2024 4:10:41 GMT -5
Could be a rich bog or a lean bog unfortunately.
When I changed to the 21mm carb, which is overkill for the Malossi Sport, I had a lean bog after leaning up the carb pretty severly from stock.
The temp is what I watched to get it right, after some acceleration I could see temps spiking quite quickly when off the throttle, which said to me either pilot / idle or needle was too lean. I am at negative density altitude though... you may be too.
Sounds possibly too lean on the main in your case. Worth trying a few sizes higher anyway, to see if that works.
Might be detonation, at higher rpm, rather than reed flutter, which I think is only supposed to happen at much higher rpm. Could be way wrong there though, check plug for whiteness, and make sure your oil content is not so high that it's causing the whole thing to be lean.
Also the vibration could be anything else attached to the crankshaft, or that the crank itself is out of true / balance. Only way to fix this is replace the crank, or take the current crank out and true it. Never done this, but Alex has the best video explainantion of how to do this as far as I can see. It's expensive but might be worth throwing a new crank at it, especially if you are riding it pretty hard.
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Post by 245luigi on Aug 19, 2024 9:37:25 GMT -5
Right, I have been having trouble in my mind trying to figure out what exactly in the carb needs to be adjusted for a whack to WOT. I have considered going back to the stock airbox with two holes drilled with stuffers (recommended by the Malossi carb kit, I went straight to pod filter from unmolested stock airbox). I get that pod filters are meant for race bikes but I'm not 100% sure I have a race bike just yet lol I believe its scooterstreet (some AU scooter shop that makes yt videos) said pod filters are good for race bikes but other than that, you can make em work, but can be a tuning nightmare.
I'll try going up 2-3 sizes on the main and see if anything changes. Thats an easy check. Ever since I have raised the port, temps have been lower since my unmolested kit. I assume thats because compression dropped. Temps came slightly up after I decked the head, but I still basically around the 320 F that was told to me earlier in the thread. Not hitting 380F like before anymore. I also removed my zip tie that held the oil pump open all the time so that should in theory richen the mixture. Off the throttle temps are going down for sure. They really only go up when WOT. Other throttle positions tend to bring it down.
I'm using some weird malossi recommended iridium plug so Idk how that affects tip reading. But I should be able to see detonation with a visual inspection no? I have opened up the cylinder head a couple times and all looks good. If I actually read the piston wash, I would say rich because its not even forming a pattern but perhaps that takes time.
If my vibration is crank itself, it came that way stock. I have had this resonance before, ever since actually getting a BBK 10 years ago or so, just happened to only happen downhill when I would actually reach the higher rpm. Now I can reach it comfortably on flats so hit it more often. I've considered new crank. Athena seems to be the only option but its OEM or OEM+
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Post by broyager on Aug 19, 2024 19:59:56 GMT -5
I've never seen detonation, but afaik it's white specs on the plug or top of the piston
Great idea re airbox, try that first before changing jets
Have you mentioned what jets you are running?
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Post by 245luigi on Aug 19, 2024 23:02:02 GMT -5
No but I can go based off fuzzy memory. PHBG 19 carb, Technigas Triops Exhaust, Malossi Sponge filter, Malossi .35 mm reeds handmade
Carb should be set up as 52 Idle Jet, 40 (maybe 50) slide, W7 needle, AU 262 atomizer, 2T atomizer bushing, and 92 Main. Certain about needle and atomizer stuff, I'd have to double check everything else, but thats the ball park
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Post by broyager on Aug 19, 2024 23:16:40 GMT -5
Sounds about right, though 92 might be too small for open air filter, possibly just right for an airbox, maybe even higher. Idle is probably going to be too big, but if it starts ok and doesn't foul plugs then maybe it's ok, for the pod filter.
You will possibly need to go down around 40 if you put the airbox back on I run the 36 idle on the 21mm PHBG, 50 slide, au262, W7, and 87 for a main, but those are with an airbox, snorkel in but opened up and non expansion pipe.
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Post by 245luigi on Aug 20, 2024 9:30:02 GMT -5
Cool, I think I'll try some carb tuning next time I work on it. Lets see what happens
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