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Post by flqu06 on Jun 2, 2014 18:39:08 GMT -5
Full synthetic seems to make the engine louder.
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Post by scooterpimp on Jun 2, 2014 18:42:55 GMT -5
Full synthetic seems to make the engine louder. & makes your wallet smaller. |
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Jun 3, 2014 0:52:08 GMT -5
i think it might have to do with the synthetic getting thinner as it gets hotter (as in thinner than conventional oils). just my opinion. i use MAG1 brand 15w40 from Family Farm and Home. its formulated for diesel AND gas engines. it exceeded the standards for a whole bunch of manufacturers warranties like cummins and international. if it works for a semi it works for a gy6 engine.
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Post by FrankenMech on Jun 4, 2014 22:55:09 GMT -5
What is wrong with Crisco?
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rpmcycleservice
Scoot Member
looking forwards to the zombie apocalypse!!
Posts: 50 
Location: here......right here....
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Post by rpmcycleservice on Jun 5, 2014 9:57:11 GMT -5
Thought we were talking about scooter lube here....(ducks head for the inevitable fallout.....)
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Post by kkzxxx on Jun 5, 2014 18:20:25 GMT -5
switched from 10w40 to 5w50 and oil temp dropped about 10-20°C
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Post by scooterpimp on Jun 6, 2014 4:53:48 GMT -5
What is wrong with Crisco? I prefer Platypus Urine... |
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Post by FrankenMech on Jun 6, 2014 14:41:34 GMT -5
What is wrong with Crisco? I prefer Platypus Urine... I never tried that..... |
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Post by craisin on Jun 6, 2014 19:38:03 GMT -5
I prefer Platypus Urine... I never tried that..... it make your breathe stink like an aussies armpit |
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Post by craisin on Jun 17, 2014 3:49:29 GMT -5
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rareanimal
Scoot Member
Posts: 75
Location: Apopka FL
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Post by rareanimal on Mar 12, 2019 11:42:55 GMT -5
I use the rotella due to my wet clutch chain drive qmb139 odd duck. It does seem to break down quickly in my opinion so I change it often.
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Post by SMALL CC TEK on May 18, 2019 0:35:07 GMT -5
Nothing wrong with 15/40 Rotella in your scooter at all. I have run it in my street bikes for years cars etc even my jet boat and if you know anything about a Jet Boat they kill motors ! lol The loads are so crazy from off idle if anything is marginal it will let go ! lol 15/40 is all good plus like others have said your qmb is not high revving and even if it did that oil will handle it . And the guy that told you diesels don't get that hot was wrong with 14/1 17/1 compression rations and higher they get hot man ... Oil is a sticky subject but you find any oil on the market and i bet someone in this forum has used it in a scooter i bet ! I have used over 12 searching for a better oil for the summer months in the 110 heat /
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Post by ThaiGyro on May 21, 2019 23:03:11 GMT -5
All nice and fun points above, but to your original opinion...
First note, you all might recall reading owners manuals regarding oils and viscosity recommendations. All manufacturers give an overlapping range, based on ambient temperatures, not engine temperatures. So running slightly different viscosity is not an issue, really. The heavier the lower it flows, the lighter end moves more easily.
Multi viscosity oils are formulated to ensure good oil flow when the engine is COLD. For example: 5W-30. When cold it has the thermal viscosity of a lighter oil to reduce wear from dry friction, by ensuring a better flow through passages. The "W" (for Winter) means it was tested at a lower temperature, because motor oils are all rated at full averaged operating values. That is set by world wide standards at 100 Degrees C. (210 F.) OK...yes,that is an average of all engines operating temperatures, but that is what the lubricants testing is set at.
In cold conditions consider using a lower "W" number for added protection. Now, when the oil heats up, it becomes more resistant to high temperatures. Hence, the number change from 20 to 60. (Yes, 60) Meaning, simply, that it performs like a lighter oil (20 wt.) at 100C, or a heavier oil (60 wt) at 100C. More protection at a higher value. The actual difference here? Not much! The test is quite simple: A specific amount of oil is preheated to 100C, in a pyrex cup, it is opened into a drain pipet containing a tiny (standard) orifice. (hole) The amount of time it takes for the oil to drain is the viscosity. (It is a bit more complicated, but no need here) The factor is a rating called centistokes. (Kinematic viscosity chart) Specific quantity, measured time at a given temperature.
Additives, it gets complicated more. I will try to simplify what is important to know. All oils have a Viscosity Index rating, based on it's final formulation.
The group range is Group I through group V. (Roman numerals, not sure why) Group I & II. For me? Never use them. The original two groups are based on a few things...importantly, the poorer of crude quality. Crude's are very different, but come in 2 basic types. Paraffinic and Napthenic. Paraffin, like wax. Naptha, like the wax. That is where the wax comes from. Secondly, the old method of separating the lube stock from crude's, was an extraction method. Not bad, but too much paraffin remains. VI additives were used to create a better flowing oil at cold conditions...at the cost of thermal breakdown. Good protection for a very short period. AVOID these types. VI number of 140 or less is not good. It's on the bottle, I think.
Group III, is a strange overlap of laws. Some are labelled "synthetic". They really are not. They simply are Group I & II oils with the sulfur removed. AVOID this if you can. Tricky advertising and blending allows for the synthetic designation. IT is way better than I & II, however.
Group IV & V are where you need to be looking, if you can afford them. Forget V, Group IV really...they are PAO synthetics which use a patented process of base oil creation. It is a selective reaction process which generated ultra high quality stocks. No paraffin, no naptha. No need for VI additives. Expensive due to the equipment and processing costs.
Lastly, a short version of 50/50 synthetics. A compromise between Group IV PAO and Group III values. Therein is the "loophole". I buy these from known suppliers, because they perform well in all vehicles. If you change oil at good frequencies, you will not have a problem. My personal comparison, yes, in a lab from my own vehicles... showed about 2/3 the life of a full PAO synthetic. I participated in a test of a diesel rated Group IV. (High Quality filters too) We drove 10,000 miles and the oil was still in the conforming range, meaning high protection. The Group III & IV blends were similar at ~7000 or a bit more miles. That was in a Toyota V-6 pickup.
Remember this as well...quantity helps. Scooters have very little capacity, motorcycles too. My Cummins diesel carried 12+ quarts. More will last longer. Adjust your maintenance accordingly.
I did work in the oil industry...still do sometimes. I also have slept at a Holiday Inn Express.
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Post by GrumpyUnk on May 22, 2019 9:27:10 GMT -5
FWIW, many diesels have oil cooling jets that squirt oil at the bottom side of the piston crown. Purpose? To absorb and remove heat. The hottest part of an engine, spark or diesel, is the exhaust valve, followed by the piston crown(IMO). Oil is used exactly to get hot and then fall back to the crankcase to dissipate the piston heat. So, in that respect, diesel oil is subject to a lot of heat. Add in the that the oil is used to lube & cool the turbo used in so many diesels, and you must agree that is does have to face a lot of heat. At least I think it does.
I would have no problem using lubes rated for diesels in a 139 or GV6, or most any cycle engine.
Honda, back a lot of years, recommended to use regular motor oil in their CB350 series. Those definitely have a wet clutch. Memory says the recommended lube was 10W40, with 10W30 as second choice. I used regular motor oil in both of the ones I owned.
To add just a bit, Oldsmobile had a turbo charged 215cid V8 that used alcohol/water(?) injection to cool the pistons when the turbo kicked in. I think it also had oil jets to cool the pistons. I think a late model VW engine also used oil jets for the same purpose. It is just to note that beyond lubrication, oil carries away heat from combustion and friction. If you look at the lube diagram of the 139, you will see that two areas are supplied oil under pressure, the connecting rod big end bearing and the rocker arm assembly. The former absorbs/transfers the acceleration/deceleration force of the piston as it comes to a stop at either end of its stroke, and then accelerates in the opposite direction, the latter has rubbing friction of the followers on the cam lobes. Without a good supply of lubricant, those areas would heat up and score the lobes and followers very quickly. The rubbing is also destroying the viscosity improvers built into multi-grade oils. The oil is put into 'shear', and gets sliced to ribbons as it is squeezed between the lobe and the follower, and then is squished when the lobe starts to open the valve by pushing on the follower. It needs oil for lube and carrying heat.
Change your oil often. After all, it's less than 1 liter of lube and doesn't take much time. WallyWorl Super Tech is as good as the other brands if you use regular oil. Synthetics? I would not want to offer an opinion other than BobIsTheOilGuy posts seem to indicate the sales leader(mobil1) may not be all it is supposed to be. I do not know. I use semi-synthetic blend in one car, and regular in the others.
tom
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