Triton # 2 (T2) 49cc to 110cc & Nearly Everywhere In Between

[90GTVert]

Jul 9, 2019 9:41:36 GMT -5 oldgeek said:

**looks like the top mounting bolt for the airbox is missing?

Is it missing if I didn't mean for it to be there? lol When I got this thing together last year and was trying to improve things where I could, I made up a spacer setup so I could use the lower of the 2 airbox mounts to bolt it on. Before that, I would just put a zip tie through the lower mount and CVT cover so the airbox wouldn't disappear if it ever fell off of the carb. With the reed spacer and 21mm Dell, it won't properly bolt on without some sort of spacing. I think the top one doesn't even want to line up, which is why I didn't bother with any sort of spacer for it. I figured, just like you don't want to mount an exhaust with a bunch of tension on it, it wouldn't make sense to put tension on the airbox. This lets it sit basically where it naturally would.

[Jwhood]

Man those wheels do look good and the writing on the tires with white was the icing on the cake, bro it looks badass

[90GTVert]

I filled T2 with pre-mix and coolant. Fired it up and it acted like it was struggling. Like the crank was hard to turn or something, as it came to an abrupt halt. The kicker moved as normal. Fired it up again and revved it and it did the same thing. Kicker still moved fine. "Alright, one more time before I have to check it over." It started up and idled happily around 1800-2100RPM. Warmed it up and topped off the coolant.

Got my gear on and headed out for a short ride, 6-7 miles to get it good and hot so I could then let it cool and re-torque the cylinder nuts. As I got to the end of the driveway, the idle went up to 3,500RPM or so. Hoped it was just a lean spot hanging. I hadn't touched any adjustments on the carb since the last time it ran.

I ran it up to speed and then let it coast down and repeated that multiple times. I was doing that because the cylinder was quickly honed while it was apart and it has a new piston and rings. Seemed to be running alright.

I got near the end of the road, about 3 miles out, and it started heating up quickly. At first I was waiting for it to return to normal, since I have seen the gauge act up before. Didn't happen. I turned around and it heated up quickly so I shut it off and coasted as long as I could. Pushed it a bit since temps were still high.

I stopped and looked and the water pump was missing a bolt. Totally gone, so the pump was loose and coolant had drained. Awesome. Not sure how this happened. I torqued the 3 bolts to the spec in the Aerox manual, which was about 7ft-lbs for the 5mm bolts IIRC. Now I'm wondering if the drive wheel and studs for the water pump may have been having issues with engaging when I first fired it up. I will take the whole water pump off and look whenever I work on it.




Back to the ride. Even after seeing this, I decided to see how far I could get before it got really hot again. It was about 90F and very humid and sunny and I'm too old, fat and busted up to push a scooter for very long... especially wearing a helmet, jacket and gloves over the usual t-shirt and jeans. It hasn't been more than a couple of years since I broke down on a near 100F humid day and pushed off and on for hours after hours of riding in that, but it was not happening today.

I didn't make it far. A few hundred feet maybe before it was super hot. Pushed more. Rode another quick burst. Pushed till I got near my house and then rode the last 1/8 mile.

If I didn't give the freshly filled cylinder head a stress test with this, I prob never will. Looks like I was trying to set records. CHT showed a max of 411F (normally maxes closer to 300F). Coolant temp showed a max of 495F, although I think that's more of a combo of CHT and air temp in the cavity where coolant should have been. Cookin'.





See, it's a good thing I took pics last night. Now I have coolant all over a bunch of stuff.

One bit of good news. The front brake no longer pulsates after replacing the rotor.

[ryan_ott]

It’s better to find the issues when your close to home rather then the beach. A dab of blue loctite should be all you need. Reminds me I haven’t pulled my pump cover in about 250 miles. I guess I know what I’m doing tonight.

[90GTVert]

I'll definitely use thread locker this time. Just odd to me that it sat here and idled for a bit and didn't leak a drop and just shy of 3 miles later a bolt is gone. I didn't even have a single tool on me because it was just going to be a super short 6-7 mile ride and I was confident that it would be fine that long... or the head filler would melt and tools wouldn't save me anyway. I should know by now to have 0 confidence in myself.

[ryan_ott]

You should see what I had under my seat for my 85 mile ride. Rain cut it short I was going for 100.

[90GTVert]

I took the cover off. I was kind of expecting to see something wrong. Looked fine.




Took the whole pump off. Everything looked fine. It looks like the bolt just loosened up and that was it. Nothing else obvious to me. I had another bolt around that was a close match so I reinstalled it and applied blue thread locker before torquing. Also re-torqued the cylinder nuts and tightened the header bolts and checked a few others.

I cut grass for about 5 hours so the thread locker had time to setup and then took a quick ride. I intended to ride farther if things went well, but it was fouling the plug from the start with under 7 miles on the plug. I rode 13 miles and made the mistake of going through my little town just before I got home. Caught the 1 red light in town and then it sputtered and bucked all the way through town doing about 25-30 WOT. I thought people stared at T2 before, but try having bright wheels and a bright jacket plus weird T2 while it's WOT making all sorts of weird noises through the middle of town.

Most of the ride was back roads and WOT though. It ran well there. I'm much happier with these road tires. I don't know why I put up with dual sport tires for so long. There's a clear difference in the feeling on turns after switching back. I noticed that it was worse when I first got the dual sports, but it's more clear going this way.

Checked the plug and I'd say it shows pretty obvious signs of fouling.




I decided to try out a BPR8HS. It has a projected tip that hopefully will help it at low speed. I had to raise the idle and lean it out when I started it with this plug. Not sure if that's just a coincidence.




I headed to Easton, and held it WOT for 9 miles straight. Max CHT was 287 and coolant temp got to about 145 by the time I got to town. I rode around town for a bit and it did alright. Feels like it's missing a little punch, but I also set the timing a little back and I'm not sure about the carb tune.

I was sitting at a light and kept hearing someone yelling something. It was some girl yelling "Excuse me!" over and over. Never realized who it was till she was going by when her lane's light turned, still trying to yell to me. That made me paranoid so I pulled over to make sure nothing was falling off of the scooter. Good thing I did. I noticed that the exhaust sounded slightly louder than normal and saw a crack forming in the header. Headed straight home from there.

As I traveled, it got loud. I pulled over at one point after it got really loud and took this pic.




I got home with a headache (2Ts are really loud with no silencer) and unbolted the pipe. It's pretty bad.








At least otherwise it did OK. I think I should be going over the carb again. It's either just way rich or I need to find the right spark plug. It has fouled way too many plugs in recent history. So far no crazy pressurized cooling system. Hopefully it stays that way.

[aeroxbud]

You did a real number on that pipe. Do you think it can be saved?
Sometimes it just seem one problem after another. But at least no damage to the water pump.

[90GTVert]

I don't see why the pipe can't be saved. There is no replacement for it anyway; 190mech made it. Just gotta figure out if I'm welding it or want to try brazing for the first time. ryan_ott gave me a little propane or mapp gas and oxygen torch and a few rods. Now I can't remember what each rod was for and he said something about either propane or mapp being bad for doing pipes, so I'll have to figure that out if I go that route. EDIT : Looked it up and it's propane that was said to possibly cause cracking.

[190mech]

I think the headpipe metal is likely wearing thin from lots of miles,,either way you choose to get it back together a doubler wrapped and welded around the repair would strengthen it..Will probably break somewhere near by after that fix though..Be glad to fab you a fresh headpipe,but will need the pipe as its hand built!

[jloi]

Hey guys , I did some googling etc . but haven't really found out / decided . what kind of welding is appropriate for welding to frame . I read where MAPP can produce brittle welds. Anyway could somebody in the know fill me in on right type for DIY . Local shop needs $75 . minimum which is fine - except I can't afford that and think I can do it myself . just need to be pointed in right direction .

 pretty sure I could end up with some kind of minimal home/garage  DIY setup ; could just use a little guidance

I remember it from 9th grade shop.

[90GTVert]

Jul 11, 2019 9:27:18 GMT -5 190mech said:

I think the headpipe metal is likely wearing thin from lots of miles!

What makes it thin with use? Is it related to heating cycles? Never thought about a pipe thinning.

If it's wrapped, does that mess with the thermal properties? I was looking at ceramic coating for this exhaust when I was getting the wheels powdered (boy am I glad I didn't now) and read about people saying that even a ceramic coating could mess up a pipe's action.

[90GTVert]

I had cracks going everywhere, so I drilled a hole at the end of any crack that I could find and then cleaned the area with a wire brush and acetone.










Here's the torch kit and rods courtesy of Ryan.




I guessed I should use this type of rod.




My first time using a dual gas torch. That's kinda fun. It took me a minute to realize how much oxygen it needed. I kept turning up the mapp gas and then blowing it out. I also knew that Ryan and reviews said oxygen goes really fast, so I was trying to keep it low. Just doesn't work.

This is attempt 1. Looked too cold to me. I was trying to keep the rod pre-heated, because I was watching the thin steel do all sorts of funky orange things otherwise.




2nd attempt seemed better to me and I realized that you can get the filler to flow if it's hot enough.




Then I figured I should prob try to do as much as I can at once and keep the heat in the pipe as I go. If you think my welding is bad, wait till you look at my brazing. This is where it's at. One of the big lumps is because a big hole (prob 1/4" x 3/8") quickly formed in the pipe as I tried to heat along one crack. I tried to let the rod flow, but I suck at it. Some of the lumps are from welds in the past (it cracked in the same area at one point). Looking at John's super neat seams next to my mess.








I was going to try to see if the filler would flow or if I had to add more to some areas where it looked like cracking was still there or it wasn't bonded great. Turned on the torch and then watched the flame slowly go back to orange. They really weren't kidding about how fast the oxygen goes with this.


So, I have been planning to try to make it to the beach Saturday. The friend that I play guitar with on Saturdays will be gone so I knew I had no reason not to go this Sat at any time of the day that I wish (like in the day when deer aren't out... I've been seeing a lot of them in corn fields lately and it still kinda scares the ____ outta me sometimes). Given the mess I'm making of this and the high risk of failure even after any repair, that's sounding like a bad idea. I'm afraid to destroy the exhaust before (as it sounds like needs to happen) a new header is made. I could bolt up the Phongeer. I loved it for years, but then I got the Peace Pipe setup worked out and John did the Penton mod and now I don't really want anything else on there.

If it looks like I could make it, I may ride this weekend. Otherwise, I'll prob plan on shipping it out to John.

This scooter isn't even that fast and I'm always down for some reason. It's almost as if they were never meant to haul a 300lb dude around for thousands of miles at 60MPH, leaving most green lights at WOT, with wheelies and burnouts thrown in occasionally.

[190mech]

Right,heat cycles and erosion cause the metal to thin over time..Some of the aircraft exhausts I work on get paper thin,no way to weld repair that,so we get a new one(or make one if its an old bird..).

[90GTVert]

Jul 11, 2019 11:54:57 GMT -5 190mech said:

Right,heat cycles and erosion cause the metal to thin over time..Some of the aircraft exhausts I work on get paper thin,no way to weld repair that,so we get a new one(or make one if its an old bird..).

The pipe will prob be headed your way before long then. As much as I wanna ride, I don't want to screw this pipe up. At least I've got it back together enough that maybe it won't fall apart in shipping.