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Post by Cincikid on Dec 8, 2016 10:59:04 GMT -5
Like Brent was saying look for Taiwanese rings.
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Post by Kasperthelost on Dec 8, 2016 14:34:22 GMT -5
Ok ran it again just now it smoked for a few minutes then stopped so I let it run for like ten minutes more til it was warmed up no more smoke I'm currently letting it cool off then I'm going to try again and see what happens although even if these rings are ok I'm still looking to get NCY rings for sure I may even look into getting a bbk from them too. Although the one I currently have seemed pretty well made compared to the stock parts.
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Post by Kasperthelost on Dec 8, 2016 15:58:12 GMT -5
Ok just went and started it again and let it warm up there is a whiteness to the exhaust when I first start it but as soon as the auto choke shuts off it seems to be normal could it be extra fuel that's giving it a white color? I do have a 100 main jet currently and a 38 pilot. It starts right up faster and better than before the swap. I even rode it across My driveway and back with light throttle. Also when I first start it and it has a whitish color it's not like smoke it's more like when it's cold and you first start your car and it's white a little bit is this normal? I hope I'm even making sense it also smells really strongly of gas when it first starts. I'm thinking maybe it's rich but it seems to run fine. I don't know I guess I'm going to keep starting it and running it for periods of time and let it warm up and then start trying short rides if it doesn't crap out it should mean I'm good right? I'm going to take my time slowly breaking it in like someone suggested to me awhile back and see how it goes if it keeps running and doesn't smoke or make noises in my opinion that means success as long as it obviously rides and performs as it should but so far she seems to be the best since I started this project. I'll keep everyone posted on progress thanks again as always you 49ccscoot is the best thing since the scooter was invented. Updates soon.
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Post by 90GTVert on Dec 8, 2016 16:20:46 GMT -5
Excess fuel usually makes soot and black smoke. White could be oil or water/coolant steam, but it's not liquid cooled and you shouldn't be accumulating a lot of moisture. Fuel would have to be unburned to come out white, and at that point it should be washing down the cylinder walls and probably not running.
I went through something like this with my 150. It would smoke on startup and sometimes go away. Tried to replace the valve seals, but had to replace the rings to stop it.
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Post by humanshield on Dec 8, 2016 19:09:26 GMT -5
I had a similar issue with my 150. In my case it was the valve stem seals.
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Post by Cincikid on Dec 8, 2016 19:14:37 GMT -5
The sound is like its a struggling motor kind of noise kind of like bogging but different How many miles are on it? Did you break it in properly? Could it be soft seizing? Here's my best advice from MY experience with 100cc BBK's (YMMV) When you get it running DO NOT take off riding it in the beginning. You have to break it in. It will run VERY VERY hot at first and this is when permanent damage can occur. Make sure you're running AT LEAST a 90 Main jet. Here's how I would recommend you break it in.....
It is important that with this kit, you do not push it too hard too soon. Many people make that mistake.
This is for a 4 stroke with a 100cc BBK and is different for 2 strokes and other size BBK's
First start.....let it run for about 30 seconds...turn it off and let it cool down (no riding)
Second start....let it run for about 60 seconds...turn it off and let it cool down (no riding)
Third start....let it run for about 90 seconds...turn it off and let it cool down (no riding)
On these next two rides listen CAREFULLY for ANY tinking, pinging or rattling noises from the motor.
If you hear ANYTHING like that OR if it bogs out... STOP...TURN IT OFF...PUSH IT HOME....RAISE THE MAINJET SIZE to 95
(it will be more likely to be running lean than rich...and it's better to err of the side of rich)
Fourth start...ride it GENTLY down your street, go back home...let it cool down
Fifth start....ride it GENTLY down your street, go back home...let it cool down
Sixth start....ride it GENTLY for about 1 mile, then go back home and let it cool down.
Seventh start...ride it GENTLY for about 1 mile, then go back home and let it cool down.
Eigth start....ride it gently for about 1/2 mile then gently roll the throttle to 3/4 for 3 seconds then back off and go back home...let it cool down
Resist the urge to push it hard for right now.
Repeat the sixth through eigth start steps, slowly increasing the distance until you reach 100 miles on the BBK
From 100 miles to 500 miles it is still breaking in but you should be past the most dangerous part of break in after 200 miles. You should be able to safely push it a LITTLE bit harder now but do not go on WOT runs yet.
After 250 miles should be able to do some short WOT runs but remember that it will still be running hotter than after about 500 miles are on it.
These 100cc BBK's run hot hot hot at first. It's critical to keep it from seizing or soft seizing due to all this heat. It will run MUCH cooler after 500 miles.
Read more: 49ccscoot.proboards.com/thread/17514/bbk-new-install-crank#ixzz4QewPfKrA
^^^ |
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Post by Kasperthelost on Dec 8, 2016 23:33:45 GMT -5
Ok I have been doing exactly what you suggested for breaking it in I'm not to the point of riding anywhere yet taking it slow and like I said I don't think it's smoke it doesn't smell like burning and it's not billowy like smoke it's more like a cold engine you can almost barely see it maybe I'm just over reacting I'm going to try and post a video tomorrow and am going to change the oil to see if there's any funny business going on there I am going to order the new rings though hopefully next week I'll have the money. I know it was smoke at first for sure but now I think it's just the exhaust because it's cold out up here this time of year. Like I said I'm going to keep an eye on it for the next couple starts and if it seems ok I may ton to the next step and attempt riding it down the street a bit not far just far enough to heat the engine a lil bit maybe a half mile. I don't think it could be mean it has a 100 main jet. I will keep everyone posted tomorrow I will give it another try. Thanks for the help guys and no matter what I am getting the new rings suggested.
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Post by Kasperthelost on Dec 20, 2016 16:33:00 GMT -5
Ok today I finally received the new Taiwanese piston rings from scrappydogscooters I hope these are good they were $25 so tomorrow (weather permitting of course) I'm going to install the new rings do I have to clock them exactly like it show in the diagram? If so could somebody post the diagram. Thanks. I hope these rings finally get my bike running like it should. It's been down almost 2 months and it's my primary vehicle! So it's killing me I know when it's finally up and running right and broke in it will all be worth it and I have learned how to do most every job on the bike now so if anything craps out I can now say I have done everything but split the case.
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Post by humanshield on Dec 20, 2016 18:37:41 GMT -5
It's important to get the rings situated properly. VERY important.
I don't have the diagram but "Basically" you want the gaps 120 degrees apart from each other. You do not want the ring ends to be over the wrist pin holes. The two very thin oil ring end gaps must NOT line up. They should be at least 120 degrees apart and not above the wrist pin hole.
Take extra time with the oil rings and the spacer. Get it right.
You also want to make sure the rings fit in the bore properly. Look up Brent's video for the exact gap but the gap shouldn't be t00 small or too large. Basically you will set the rings in the cylinder bore without the piston and square them with the piston crown...then measure the gap.
When inserting the piston take your time and don't force the cylinder over the piston rings. "Work" it on gently helping squeeze the rings with your thumbnail to help it go into the cylinder. Force could damage the rings.
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Post by Kasperthelost on Dec 20, 2016 20:59:22 GMT -5
Ugh ring gapping stresses me out that could be the issues I'm having with the cheap O rings the bbk came with so I plan on doing these right. Shouldn't the ring gaps be good right from the box? What should the gaps be?
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Post by Kasperthelost on Dec 20, 2016 21:01:44 GMT -5
Also do I have to take the piston off again to do this?
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Post by humanshield on Dec 20, 2016 22:13:36 GMT -5
Brent has a couple of videos that does a good job of explaining the ring gapping and I recommend you watch it before you install the new rings.
You do not have to take the piston off but it helps to square up the rings in the cylinder to check the gaps.
"usually"....the gaps are ok....BUT....that is when they come WITH the piston. You are using rings that did not come with that piston. You need to check the gaps unfortunately.
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Post by 90GTVert on Dec 21, 2016 8:16:45 GMT -5
You can find ring gapping info and a diagram in the link below. Don't stress over perfect placement. Rings will move anyway. www.49ccscoot.com/bbk.html |
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Post by Kasperthelost on Dec 21, 2016 13:11:25 GMT -5
My install of the new rings went perfectly I haven't tried to start it yet I had to leave my house I will try to start when I get home. I HOPE AND PRAY this fixes my problems.everything was done as the how to told me and since now I've done it about 10 times I know everything was done right let's hope it works.strange thing is the old rings were set right and nothing in there was messed up no metal shavings just a little blackness on the top of the piston it wasn't alot no issues at all so I don't know why it was acting the way it was. More later thanks guys! Let's hope this fixes it so I can start a new thread.
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Post by Kasperthelost on Dec 21, 2016 14:31:03 GMT -5
Update the noise is gone and the smoke I have only ran it for a few minutes I'm following breakin suggestions from another member. I hope this is finally it and I'll be riding in the next day or so if only a mile away and back I know not to push it at all to basically putt putt for awhile, first I'm going to let it just idle for short periods of time until I think it can handle a small ride that is only if the noise and smoke stay gone fingers crossed. Thank you all SO MUCH FOR ALL YOUR HELP LATELY AND IN THE FUTURE! More soon.
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