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Post by nikg736 on Oct 22, 2017 21:28:14 GMT -5
New to the forum. I got a 50CC 4-stroke scooter a few weeks ago and it had no spark. I tried various CDI and coils and spark plugs. It had no spark but then last weekend for some reason it started getting spark after I tested the stator. Didnt do anything different...just tested the AC voltage on stator and then magically it had spark. I got it to fire up with some starting fluid but the carb was no good. So I ordered a new carb and installed it today..went to fire it up and nothing. Checked for spark again and...no spark. I have hooked up three CDI's two of which are brand new and one that had been working when i did have spark. Also have tried 3 different coils and 2 spark plugs one of which is a brand new NGK. The only other possible thing I can think of is a bad stator. Tested it again tonight but it showed 70 volts AC on power and 2v on pickup. I didnt test ohms, but if it is producing this kind of voltage i figure it is good. I tested for continuity on all wires from CDI to coil, power, pickup and ground. Also I have disconnected the kill switch wire just in case it was a bad ground on the kill switch preventing the CDI from working.
Also, the starter on this thing works intermittently and i dont know why...maybe a bad switch. I checked it and couldnt get it to work consistently. I have tried to get spark with kick start and also by jumping the solenoid to run the starter but still nothing.
At this point I am at a total loss as to what to do. I have no idea why I had no spark, then good spark and now no spark again. I have tested all the components in the system that would generate spark and they all are fine...so now I am just confused. Any advice is much appreciated
Thanks
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Post by lostforawhile on Oct 22, 2017 22:34:51 GMT -5
2 volts on the pickup is a little low, did you check the pickup to magnet gap? if it's right on the edge it might work sometimes,and not work sometimes, is yours a five wire? check the ground on the green wire going to the stator, it grounds to the stator frame, also check the engine to frame ground are those your voltages while running or cranking? you need to hook an ohm meter to the black and red wire at the cdi and check the cranking voltage, if it's low it will be hard to start
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Post by tortoise2 on Oct 22, 2017 22:37:12 GMT -5
Excellent presentation!
If you have not already done so . . try removing the plastic flywheel fan and, while wearing eye protection, blow compressed air into the flywheel bolt holes and around the perimeter.
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Post by lostforawhile on Oct 22, 2017 22:46:04 GMT -5
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Post by tocoo on Oct 23, 2017 2:33:08 GMT -5
About removing the FLYWHEEL, I see videos where an impact drill is used to remove the bolt without this special tool. Do you confirm that the impact tool cannot break things ? how to put back the bolt without breaking anything ?
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Post by pinkscoot on Oct 23, 2017 5:39:07 GMT -5
The tool is for after you remove the bolt the flywheel is still pressed on the scoot.
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Post by jackrides on Oct 23, 2017 12:53:01 GMT -5
Yes a powered impact wrench can break things, but that rarely happens. Be sure that it is spinning the correct direction ( left hand threads or right hand threads?). If the flywheel is tightly held, hold the impact socket with a glove and turn it in the direction you want it to go. Helps a lot. If the nut has been on for a long time, there might be corrosion. Spray on some penetrating oil (WD-40?) and wait a half hour or overnight. Before reinstalling the flywheel, be sure the shaft, hole and key are clean, put a Little oil on the surfaces, and slide on the flywheel with a Little wiggle (the flywheel, not you) to help it seat straight. You can use your hand to hold the flywheel and impact wrench; but it's better to use the flywheel holder and a torque wrench.
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Post by lostforawhile on Oct 23, 2017 13:10:00 GMT -5
Get the variator lock tool, trust me, you will use it many many times, with that tool and the flywheel tool, changing a stator is a piece of cake, other methods may damage your flywheel
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Post by lostforawhile on Oct 23, 2017 13:13:37 GMT -5
Get the variator lock tool, trust me, you will use it many many times, with that tool and the flywheel tool, changing a stator is a piece of cake, other methods may damage your flywheel
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Post by nikg736 on Oct 24, 2017 21:01:50 GMT -5
Thanks for all the input. I did order a removal tool from eBay...wish I had looked on Amazon first...it is a few bucks cheaper and would have gotten here quicker. Oh well..no big deal I did check the gap of pickup to the flywheel magnet but there is no way to change it. I loosened the bolts that hold the pickup sensor but there is no way to shift it down...as soon as I tighten the bolts it goes back to its original position. I was thinking there must be something going on with the stator because I have subbed out all the other parts with at least 2-3 variants. I am thinking the pickup gap or maybe some dirt etc within the flywheel housing.
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Post by nikg736 on Oct 24, 2017 22:13:03 GMT -5
Does one really need the variator tool? This is a scooter that I am repairing as more of a hobby than need for transportation. I am not sure how many times I will be removing flywheels etc. I have seen many videos where it looks like you just need to loosen the nut and use the flywheel removal tool which I did purchase
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Post by lostforawhile on Oct 24, 2017 22:21:47 GMT -5
Does one really need the variator tool? This is a scooter that I am repairing as more of a hobby than need for transportation. I am not sure how many times I will be removing flywheels etc. I have seen many videos where it looks like you just need to loosen the nut and use the flywheel removal tool which I did purchase these scooters eat belts, roller weights,etc, plus the variator itself, not only that,it locks the engine in place or any other repairs, such as loosing the flywheel net etc , the tools are cheap, and you'll wish you had it the first time you need to change a belt those are the two specialty tools you need to really be able to work on these
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Post by lostforawhile on Oct 24, 2017 22:26:07 GMT -5
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Post by greginisn on Oct 25, 2017 2:33:08 GMT -5
I have that very same tool too. It fits perfectly altho it is best to snuggle it into close contact with the Ring Gear for best results. I’m thinking you did not do a PDI and likely the previous owner didn’t either. There’s a good possibility you have a bad or loose wiring connector so it might be helpful to pull the plastics and check everywhere for a bad connection before continuing your troubleshooting. I understand it’s a PITA but it might help you solve your problems. Buy a well rated $20 digital multimeter instead of a bushel of spare parts. It will save you money in the long run, throwing parts at the scoot is a bit of a hit or miss kind of thing. And sometimes new parts are bad too. Just another 2 cents worth. Good luck, Greg
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Post by nikg736 on Oct 29, 2017 20:49:22 GMT -5
So ... I went to check for spark today and...there it is. Spark. Put the scooter back together as I had a bunch of plastics all off. The new carb I installed working great so it actually ran. We rode it around for about 30 minutes testing it out..everything was great. I really dont even know why it had spark today as opposed to any other day. Then .. 8 hours later (tonight) went to ride it again and ... no spark. Absolutely nothing had changed from when we parked it earlier. I simply dont understand what is going on with this thing!!!
Assuming it might be the stator I went to pull it and ... the tool I got wont thread into the flywheel. It has a 24mm side and a 27mm side. The 24mm seems right but when I go to thread it in it is either slightly too big or the threads are a different pitch. Has anybody had this problem? I thought all these tools and parts were pretty much generic and interchangeable.
Help?! Thanks
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