Jog-Mania

[tsimi]

Jan 14, 2015 13:48:42 GMT -5 ohhbuddy said:

nice! it's too bad they don't sell the jogs here anymore. Our last two stroke scoot from Yamaha was the Zuma/BWs in 2011 it's been replaced with the 4t 50. Very soon any new 2 stroke scooters from any manufacturer will become a thing of the past in the usa

At least your guys 2 stroke era lasted longer then ours. They don't produce / sell any new 2 strokes here in Japan anymore since 2007 i think. Everything is 4 stroke now, really too bad.
That is why Jogs like mine or that customers are expensive to purchase. The average price is currently at 800 bucks. I was lucky enough to get both of mine for free because the previous owners are co-workers of mine and they didn't needed the Scooters anymore. And now I got body parts also for free my luck seems to be holding up. lol

[nelson]

Awesome man! I own 2 jogs also. I just finished building the first one. I consider it a sleeper. It looks like a regular stock moped ( except the pipe) but at the moment will hit 65 mph. I plan on getting 75 mph soon. I stretched the frame a few inches also, not too much I didnt want it to be real noticeable. It has a mina based engine but is 90+ cc mine is a 1992 I wish it had disk breaks, thats great!

[nelson]

[tsimi]

nelson

I know your Jogs. I am following your Jog build thread with great interest.
Saw your video too, crazy acceleration you got there. From 0-60km/h in a blink of an eye.
Wish I had the $$$, knowledge and understanding of my wife to build something like that.
One day maybe...one day...who knows.

Your Jogs (3YK series?) are the best to customize. Many parts available here in Japan.

[nelson]

My jog is not going to 65 kph , that is 65 mph. 65 miles per hour or about 105 kph thanks its gonna be faster here soon! My wife knows im a gear head but she really doesnt know what its like doing 70 on 10 inch wheels!
I bought my plastics out of Denmark. I checked out webike japan and rhey have some great stuff. Here is the bike that was my inspiration.

[nelson]

[birdman]

Birdman's vert mina Jog


Not a sleeper, not fast either, mid 50 wheelie bike, Oakland PDs favorite Jog by far

[nelson]

Jan 15, 2015 11:57:40 GMT -5 birdman said:

Birdman's vert mina Jog


Not a sleeper, not fast either, mid 50 wheelie bike, Oakland PDs favorite Jog by far

Mid 50s is fast on a scooter that is supposed to go 35mph!

[tsimi]

birdman

lol your Jog looks wicked!　mid 50 is very fast (...for me at least.) Your CVT case looks like a Swiss cheese. And what are those two things left and right? Speakers?

[birdman]

Hai tsimi -san. They are speakers, because when I park the scooter inside my garage i use it to play music.

[ohhbuddy]

Jan 14, 2015 17:35:38 GMT -5 tsimi said:

Jan 14, 2015 13:48:42 GMT -5 ohhbuddy said:

At least your guys 2 stroke era lasted longer then ours. They don't produce / sell any new 2 strokes here in Japan anymore since 2007 i think. Everything is 4 stroke now, really too bad.
That is why Jogs like mine or that customers are expensive to purchase. The average price is currently at 800 bucks. I was lucky enough to get both of mine for free because the previous owners are co-workers of mine and they didn't needed the Scooters anymore. And now I got body parts also for free my luck seems to be holding up. lol

oh wow I didn't know they stop producing/selling two strokes in Japan in 2007 I thought you still had them today. That sucks

[tsimi]

Went (still am in front of the store at this very moment.) to the second hand bike parts store in Kyoto and bought a front wheel incl. break disc for $10 and a seat almost brand new also for $10. Now i can swap the terrible looking disc with the new one. Yeah!



They also have an A113E engine (Minarelli? )
incl. Stock exhaust, carb, airbox, rear wheel and rear shock still attached to the engine for 50 bucks! I was soooo close to buy that engine but how to explain to the house president what that engine is for. lol

[ohhbuddy]

spare engine maybe?

[tsimi]

Jan 19, 2015 23:23:03 GMT -5 ohhbuddy said:

spare engine maybe?

Just got a second Jog now i tell her that i need a spare engine? That will not go well.
Sometimes i wish i were single again. That would make gaming and scooter tuning so much easier.

[tsimi]

Weather started to get nice and warm again.
Took off from work today to get some private stuff done and finished faster then expected so I had spare time today and did some work on the Jogs.

Since I have two Jogs I name them Jog 1 and Jog 2 to keep better overview.

Jog 2

Replaced the bad break disc and replaced the break pads.
Thanks to birdman I could also check and clean the break piston.
Now the front and rear breaks are done.
Replaced Spark Plug.
Wire brushed, sanded and painted the rusted stock exhaust.
Next I took apart the CVT. Everything looked surprisingly good. No flat spots at all. Clutch had still enough meat on it. Belt looked good to (16mm width)
Then I looked at the Carb and Engine under the seat. Cracked intake! And a lot dust that needs to be cleaned away.
Battery seems to be bad and will be replaced.

Next step re-adjust the CVT for "both" Jogs. Some of you know my other Thread were I had initially problems with the acceleration and response of my Jog 1. At the end I ended up with this following setting.

Roller Weights: 3x 5.5g + 3x 6g
Stock Vario
Yellow Torque Spring
Additional 1mm Shim Washer

This setup gave me decent hill climb power (approx. 50-55km/h on steep hills), decent take off, good response (fading when engine got warmer) and a top speed of 68km/h. When I added the OR Variator in the past I was loosing rpm and hill climb power and I just thought it would be a good time to start from scratch again. Damn CVT tuning ...anyway I started to switch things around with Jog 2 and now I have the following setup which I will test thorough tomorrow when going to work.

Jog 1 (blue CDI)

Roller Weights: 6x 5.5g
OR Variator (*no additional shim)
Stock clutch and stock torque spring.

Jog 2 (Stock CDI)

Roller Weights: 6x 6g
Stock Variator
Additional 0.5mm Shim Washer
Yellow Torque Spring

I went for a quick and short test ride with Jog 1 and as I thought, great take off, then loss of rpm and response. Low-End: Good, Mid-Range: Bad, Top-End: not good but not bad either (very fast Top Speed)

Jog 2

No Number plate and insurance yet so no test driving on public roads for now. Just drove around my area. Typical stock Jog with brutal take off thanks to the Yellow Torque Spring.
Mid-Range and Top-End can't be tested yet.

All in all a busy scooter repair day. Really enjoyed it. Guess next will be to get a red +10% torque spring and some stiffer clutch springs.

I found this following in a Scooter Forum and I thought I post this here since it contains very good Info and I will try to tune my CVT according to it.

Could the experts please just answer the following questions/ fill in the blanks?? I will print the thread out and cherish it!

*Think of transmission changes like a mtn bike. The Vario is the chainrings up front and the rear pulley is the cassette in the back.

Also, these are generalizations. You cant just tune 1 thing in teh tranny. The springs and rollers all have to work in unison for a smooth ride.

Lighter rollers slow the time it takes to "shift" to a bigger chainring in the front. Its takes more revs to make the belt move up the vario face. Heavier rollers will "shift" the belt up the vario face faster and with more force. All things equal, heavier rollers wil have more interia to push the belt higher up the face of the vario.


1. Rollers - by changing to lighter rollers, the main effects are *slower belt movement up the face of the vario*. You will notice the change in acceleration characteristics from speeds of about *throughout your speed range*. You know your rollers are too heavy if *your throttle response is not very quick*.

Torque spring has to compliment the rollers. The easiest way to choose the correct torque spring is this:

When you accelerate and the rpms jump up, then bog down and start to climb again, then your torque spring is too weak. You keep going to a stronger torque spring until your rpms increase all the way to your max rpm. I always get the correct torque spring 1st and then tune the rollers second


2. Torque spring - by changing to a heavier torque spring, the main effects are *_____. You will notice a change in performance between speeds of ____ and ____. You know your torque spring is too weak if *your revs drop after your initial acceleration*.


3. Clutch springs - by change to a heavier clutch spring, the main effects are *higher stall rpm. You base your clutch spring strength on the powerband of your pipe. You keep going to stronger clutch springs until you dont feel that "jump (ie hit the powerband)" in power when you accelerate. Your bike should not even move until you are basically on the powerband *. You will notice a change in performace between speeds of *0* and *5*. You know your clutch springs are too weak if *when you accelerate and it runs slow and then about 10+mph it jerks forward with alot more speed*.

4. Pipe - by changing from stock to a performance pipe, the main effects are *more noise, supercharging effect, faster speed*. You will notice a change in performance between speeds of *0* and *top speed*.


===========

Also, how about breaking down what mechanism most affects performance at certain speeds?

*not 1 part of the tranny is responsible for a certain speed range. The clutch springs are the most specific, but the pulleys have the belt ride up and down them as your vary your throttle position, so they must be matched*