goodkat
Scoot Enthusiast
Posts: 178
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Post by goodkat on Nov 11, 2019 3:22:49 GMT -5
in my experience, its the splines that strip if the outer pulley isn't set on them properly. ive stripped a few nuts from installing and removing multiple times. ive also stripped the splines. I use an impact to remove and install. all that being said, you could possibly strip the threads if you hit the nut on there tight then kept going. I haven't tried that. just use a little Loctite on the nut threads when you install the nut with the impact. after tight, hammer it 2-4 pulls of the trigger and call it good. I guess the proper way would be to impact off. install with Loctite and a torque wrench to proper spec. thatll save you the stress of over tightening the nut. also, on flywheel side, put a dab of antisieze on the crankshaft taper. not the nut threads but the taper where the keyway is. it will make future removal a lot easier. the rollers get grease from honda originally. most clean it all out and run the rollers dry when reinstalling them. I run mine dry. grease isn't good for belt grip..... As usual, you helped me a lot. Will go home these days so I can take the variator and clutch out and see what's in there. Also, my brother called me, the AF35 engine is at home. Can't wait to have a look so I can see on what state it is.  Will give u a call so we can have a chat. |
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goodkat
Scoot Enthusiast
Posts: 178
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Post by goodkat on Nov 13, 2019 3:32:32 GMT -5
Last night had several hours to spend so I took apart the transmission. Finally I figured how a variator works, pretty simple thing. Took two hours to clean all the grime off of the case, the final result looks good enough. Also, because I took the clutch down, I said to myself to take the transmission cover off so I can change the oil. I did a good thing, the oil inside was so dirty and grimy. Replaced the oil with 90cc of 10w40 motor oil (I read in the Tact AF24 manual that this is the right grade for the oil), put in a new gasket and everything is fresh and tidy right now.     After this, I took down the cylinder head / cylinder to source the rattling sound. Here is the result: It seems that there is a free-play somewhere but I cannot figure if it's the top end or the bottom end. Why I'm saying this? Because when I was pushing the piston with my fingers, I could feel a light knock in the piston. A light pressure was needed to silence it down. On the otherside, I changed the piston pin and roller cage bearing previously and the sound still persists. I tried to see if there is any radial / axial play in the crankshaft by trying rocking the flywheel, there is none. Any other ideas? In the following days I will take the engine down (again) and will take the piston off. Will try to give some light taps with a rubber mallet on the top of the conrod to see if there are any weird sounds coming from the bottom end. Trying to move the rod by hand, couldn't feel anything. Maybe I was not pushing /pulling with enough force. Now, I got some questions: - Variators and clutches are universal (doubt they are but need to ask this) when it comes to 50cc scoots? I mean, what I need to look when buying one, knowing that this model of scoot is not that common? - Crankshaft - being a vertical engine, I found that is very similar to other Honda Dio, Kymco and Sym models. Any idea on how to find compatible crankshafts? Or a source where can I buy one crankshaft? I found chinese cranks, stupid cheap, but have no idea about their reliability. Cheers! |
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Post by oldgeek on Nov 17, 2019 10:40:26 GMT -5
Wow that thing was a mess, looks a lot better now. I agree, there does seem to be some play somewhere, it may be the big end of the rod.
As far as variators, I THINK anything for the AF16/AF18 will work, but I do not know for sure.
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goodkat
Scoot Enthusiast
Posts: 178
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Post by goodkat on Nov 17, 2019 13:57:03 GMT -5
Yep, I found lots of weird things. I made a list of parts for the build. Will be a bit costly but I want to have a quality scoot. 😁
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Post by oldgeek on Nov 17, 2019 20:47:53 GMT -5
Are you going a bit bigger? I have seen a couple kits that are 50mm. That brings you to 81cc with a stock stroke of 41.4
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Post by harleyracer59 on Nov 18, 2019 0:54:36 GMT -5
on the variator question, dio or af05 will fit. boss inner diameter is only difference. the boss outer diameter is 20mm on most Hondas other than the first generation nb50 engine. on that ab07 the boss inner diameter is 15mm and the outter is 22mm. 50cc gy6 variators, pulleys, and clutches are also all compatible. 14mm inner boss dia 20mm outer boss dia.  |
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goodkat
Scoot Enthusiast
Posts: 178
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Post by goodkat on Nov 18, 2019 1:20:38 GMT -5
on the variator question, dio or af05 will fit. boss inner diameter is only difference. the boss outer diameter is 20mm on most Hondas other than the first generation nb50 engine. on that ab07 the boss inner diameter is 15mm and the outter is 22mm. 50cc gy6 variators, pulleys, and clutches are also all compatible. 14mm inner boss dia 20mm outer boss dia.  boss = that cylindrical part that goes between variator and crankshaft? Two days ago I tried to fit the variator back and I noticed that the outside pulley (the one with teeth that gets engaged by the starter clutch) doesn't slide all the way on the shaft splines...only about 3 quarters. I don't find this right, isn't it? I'm missing something? |
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goodkat
Scoot Enthusiast
Posts: 178
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Post by goodkat on Nov 18, 2019 1:23:38 GMT -5
Are you going a bit bigger? I have seen a couple kits that are 50mm. That brings you to 81cc with a stock stroke of 41.4 I'd love to have a little bit of more oomph but to be honest I'm afraid that I could get in something that I don't know how to handle it, cost-wise. For example I don't know if a different carburetor is required or the standard one re-jetted will do the job. Besides this, I don't have the knowledge of tuning a carb. The slide carbs seem to be pretty simple (or at least the one that is mounted on my scoot) so maybe with some guidance I could get to a sweet spot. |
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goodkat
Scoot Enthusiast
Posts: 178
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Post by goodkat on Dec 4, 2019 14:44:47 GMT -5
Another day, another thing done. Bought myself a flywheel puller and took off the flywheel:  Found enough sand to build a sand castle. Behind the flywheel I found these bolts. What are they holding??  Another thing that might be wrong is the external part of the variator. It doesn't go all the way over the shaft splines. Is this normal?      |
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goodkat
Scoot Enthusiast
Posts: 178
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Post by goodkat on Dec 4, 2019 16:21:39 GMT -5
On: looked on the parts fiche and the bolts seem to hold the cases together.
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Post by 190mech on Dec 4, 2019 18:03:57 GMT -5
Variator looks OK,will likely need fine tuning once its running..
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goodkat
Scoot Enthusiast
Posts: 178
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Post by goodkat on Dec 4, 2019 18:35:05 GMT -5
Can you explain? Is there a tehnique I need to investigate? The rollers need to be changed...they have a small flat spot on one side.
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Post by harleyracer59 on Dec 4, 2019 19:14:07 GMT -5
Can you explain? Is there a tehnique I need to investigate? The rollers need to be changed...they have a small flat spot on one side. by fine tuning he means swapping different weight rollers, stronger contra and clutch springs and that belt! that thing looks old as fuck. I know 90gt made a vidio showing and explaining the fine art of variator tuning. search here or youtube. I would also suggest looking into a new aftermarket overrange variator and rear multi groove pulley. the aftermarket variators have different shaped ramps that the rollers travel on. they are usually taller too. that give you more distance that your belt can travel. you might need some variator boss shims/washers to space the inner and outer pulley faces. in a perfect world, you want the belt to ride as close to the center as possible for take off. the the overage variator ramps will push the belt to the outer edge at top speed. the stock rear pulley as an s cut groove that the outer pulley moves along. the S shaped groove is what creates that "gear shift" that the stock cvt does. me and a few others here prefer the straight cut grooves. that lets the cvt variate through the different ratios smoothly at a linear rate. that s groove shift can drop your scooter rpm out of your power band and in high gear, your scooter might not be able to recuperate. keeping you from your capable top speed. the weights of the rollers and the stiffness of springs slow or speed up this whole process. finally, yes those 3 bolts are the case half bolts. don't take them out unless youre splitting your cases. this is a rough fast description of this tuning. look up all the videos and read all you can on this before buying new parts. itll save you from wasting money on parts you don't need. good luck buddy |
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goodkat
Scoot Enthusiast
Posts: 178
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Post by goodkat on Dec 7, 2019 3:01:53 GMT -5
Can you explain? Is there a tehnique I need to investigate? The rollers need to be changed...they have a small flat spot on one side. I find the external face of the variator fit, weird. The spacer (bushing) between the shaft and inner variator face, is covering 3-4 mm of the shaft splines / grooves,thus preventing the external face of the variator to slide all the way in... |
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goodkat
Scoot Enthusiast
Posts: 178
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Post by goodkat on Dec 7, 2019 3:03:01 GMT -5
Thanks pal, a real help as always! |
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Will give u a call so we can have a chat.
