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Post by 190mech on Jul 30, 2013 19:49:44 GMT -5
My memory seems to think in an earlier build a GY6-50 variator was used on a 2T project.I know you have 2T variator stuff laying about...Maybe I was in the MEK too much that day?  |
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Post by moofus02 on Jul 30, 2013 20:11:07 GMT -5
MEK is some nasty stuff been there done that
Sent from my SPH-L720 using proboards
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Post by 90GTVert on Jul 31, 2013 5:51:14 GMT -5
I actually have 2 performance variators here for this engine, but I'm trying to avoid assembling all the performance parts at once. I know I went to the NCY TD, but that's more about a part that is made well. Hopefully the variator issue is not one that recurs with even a stock replacement.
I did just go out and try a minarelli variator. Doesn't work. Mine are all the large shaft minarelli version. The ID of the boss is too large so it's loose on the crank. The ID of the vari is too large so you can't use the boss from the stock variator in it. Plus the ramp plate is splined so that would have to be drilled out to work on the 4T. The splines for the fixed half are different, so it would have to use the 4T fixed half or a different key. There are 4Ts that use a 2T CVT. I know the older Baja SC50s did. I believe the crank was designed like the 2T crank as far as splines and such.
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Post by 190mech on Jul 31, 2013 9:14:54 GMT -5
Do you think the variator bushing going south was causing your wierd shifting problems and not the torque driver?
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Post by 90GTVert on Jul 31, 2013 9:25:25 GMT -5
Def could be or at least part of it. The TD had a spot where it was hanging up though. I've got the stocker still so whenever I get everything I can try it. Would make sense with this weird vibration that suddenly got crazy when it was totally failing. Still, I've had issues with stock TDs wearing in spots before, so I dunno if I'll stick with NCY that I think will hold up or stock that already appears to have wear or at least is sticking a little. At one point I thought maybe it was a way to keep the gearing best... so the TD would hang up just enough to resist changing gears till it really needed to... but if that were the case it should have always had the gear change kinda feel near max speed and not out of nowhere.... but then again the contra was "breaking in" too. Here we go again with these "simple" scooter systems that anyone can master in minutes. lol
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Post by 2strokd on Jul 31, 2013 9:47:30 GMT -5
Dang!
I have a OEM Kymco vari that should work fine if you are ever interested?
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Post by 90GTVert on Jul 31, 2013 14:25:30 GMT -5
Thanks. I ordered one yesterday, plus I have two aftermarket ones. I should be good. I'd be fine with putting on a performance one, but again then the whole project idea goes out the window if I just bolt everything on and call it done.
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Post by 2strokd on Aug 1, 2013 7:53:17 GMT -5
Your welcome.
I know the Kymco stockers are of a better quality aluminum than the GY6,s
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Post by 90GTVert on Aug 1, 2013 8:38:30 GMT -5
I bet. I actually looked on eBay for a whole Kymco GY6 50 engine after the CVT issues started and mainly because of the seal issue. I saw one but it was not cheap. I don't enjoy the headaches, but it is at least sorta interesting to see what happens to the Chinese engine/scoot. I can tell you already that you better plan on having a couple hundred bucks in reserve when you buy a super cheap scoot like this. It may have only been $700, but a PDI, seal replacement, and the vari all add up plus if you go with a different carb instead of the sealed one and jets and springs and sliders to get it in a good state of tune. You've quickly got a scooter sneaking up to $1000 where good used Kymcos, Yamahas, and Hondas start showing up.
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Post by 2strokd on Aug 1, 2013 9:15:17 GMT -5
uhuh
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Post by aeroxbud on Aug 2, 2013 4:46:06 GMT -5
Your lucky Brent, that you have good mechanical skills. You can sort the problems out and work out the faults.
This is probably why there are lots of bargain scooters about. People have them for a year, get a problem, then just park it up.
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Post by 90GTVert on Aug 2, 2013 9:59:09 GMT -5
I can only imagine buying a scooter this cheap and then going to a shop for an issue and getting a bill that's half the cost of the scoot.
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Post by 90GTVert on Aug 6, 2013 9:40:21 GMT -5
I got the replacement variator kit from joshscloseouts on eBay and the 4.5g sliders from DROW.  I installed all of that and went to go for a ride the a couple of nights ago to see how it was doing. As I pulled out of the driveway it revved to over 9000RPM taking off and then settled in to cruise speeds of 34MPH or so at 8600-8800RPM. I rode about 5 miles in a big rectangle and it would cruise 33-35MPH any way I went, so even though it wasn't where I wanted the tune it was at least doing the cruising speeds I expected. It was too late that night to be running the air compressor and going up and down the road so I tuned it the next day. I ended up needing a full gram more weight (5.5g) to get RPM back to where I had it tuned before the replacement variator. Everything looks about the same with the vari and fixed half and the drive boss matches up to the length of the old one. Not sure if the ramps are just a little different or the change is from the old variator beginning to and eventually failing. I took it for just shy of a 30 mile test ride last night. The first bad news is that the vibration is still there. It's mostly happening around 33-35MPH so I guess it's a tire or wheel balance issue. There was one time it happened at 30MPH though, so that makes me wonder a bit. The good news is that it is reliably cruising at 33-34MPH at 7700RPM on average. It was cruising at 7800RPM average at those speeds, but this is about as close as I could get in 1/4 gram increments with sliders. Max speed tucked on a flat with as little input from wind as possible was 37.5MPH @ 8000RPM. Again back on target with what I was seeing. When riding in town I could see that the new variator helped the sluggish feeling when I got on and off the throttle. I had initially attributed this solely to the less aggressive angles of the NCY torque driver. It does still feel like it's loaded more than it was when I was using the stock torque driver, which would be expected when the TD angles don't fight change quite as much. That's in town, cruising, accelerating... it always feels a bit different. I refueled at 25.7 miles and got 84.3MPG. I had really hoped my fuel mileage was going to start picking up back to the 90-95MPG range where it was before all of these CVT troubles. My best guess is that the torque driver angle is the cause, or at least the majority of it. Making the engine work harder than is necessary if it were in the proper "gear" at all times. I tried 0-30MPH runs and they averaged out to 19.12 seconds, while it was 17.91 before. I had planned to move from here to installing the Hoca ball bearing base for the contra spring. The fuel mileage and "loaded" feeling is making me a little more willing to at least try the stock replacement torque drivers I have. I'm curious to see if going back from 50 to 49 degree grooves will actually jump fuel economy back up 5-10MPG where it had been. I'm still happy at 85MPG to ride and fill up with $1-2 of premium fuel, but I'd at least like to find out if the grooves are indeed the culprit. Not sure I'll stick with them. I like that the NCY seems to be higher quality and less likely to wear and cause hang-ups in short time. The next issue is going to be when I can do this. We've got rain and high humidity forecasted for the next 5 days. Feels like it's taking forever just to get back on track between 2 weeks of parts waits and weather issues. |
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Post by 90GTVert on Aug 6, 2013 13:48:24 GMT -5
It's been raining most of the day, then it turned into a constant mist. The scoot barely wants to idle, chugging down at 1400-1500RPM when it should normally be closer to 2000RPM. I thought maybe I could at least compare torque drivers and get clips of the speed/rpm as they accelerate because I don't so much care how quick or how fast, but rather how the revs are relative to speed. Not gonna work today. The mist gets on the cam and gauge and the wind keeps changing every 5 minutes. Trying to compare one run with a headwind and one with a side wind is about like trying to compare one run uphill with one of flat ground. Can't get 2 runs in that I'd consider useful. The only thing I've accomplished with with the TaoTao today is deciding that the only torque driver other than the NCY that I want to try at all is the one that came off of the SunL. The TaoTao stock is of course worn in spots and hanging up. The replacement I got is about the same quality and already doesn't feel like a smooth motion. The whole assembly is poorly made. The SunL TD has straight grooves that work smoothyl. It's got more miles on in than any TD I have other than the NCY and doesn't show any significant wear from the pins. If you had told me when I owned the SunL that one day I'd look to it's parts as a higher standard or decent quality, I would have laughed at you.  |
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Post by 190mech on Aug 6, 2013 20:03:20 GMT -5
Glad the SunL "Turd" still lives on providing 'quality' parts for the newer gen China scoots!!  |
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