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Post by oldgeek on Jun 24, 2023 12:31:41 GMT -5
They make an adaptor that is one size smaller that is ideal with the stock style airbox. It basically covers the threads and has a small lip. Treatland again.
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Post by billwill on Jun 24, 2023 12:39:02 GMT -5
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Post by billwill on Jun 25, 2023 6:17:22 GMT -5
Measured the gear ratio as suggested and its bang on at 10 revolutions on the clutch shaft for every 1 of the rear wheel. Not sure what to do with this info just yet but from what I read, that method is just to ballpark it. I think I will try ordering a new support bearing for the CVT cover/clutch shaft and go from there to see if it takes care of the high RPM vibrations. Made some carb adjustments yesterday and here is where I landed. Moved the 38 pilot jet down to a 36 and swapped out the W6 needle for the W16. I tried the W16 in various notches from top to 2nd from the bottom and the bike runs best with the W6 needle with the clip in the top position. The bike felt happier with the fuel screw turned out 1/4 - 1/2 turn further from where it was with a 38 pilot. It's sitting at 2 full turns out now. At one point I was WOT for about a mile and a half or so and CHTs got up to about 330º so I backed off for a quarter mile or so and they went below 300º. The bike runs arguably better with the needle here in the top clip vs 2nd to top but definitely seems to run just slightly hotter. Nothing that leads me to believe I need to move it down if I keep an eye on CHTs. This was uphill too. Sounds strange but maybe I need to up the main jet from where it is now at 85 to an 88 or 90? Not sure but I'm happy with where it's at now. |
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Post by oldgeek on Jun 25, 2023 6:52:49 GMT -5
At one point I was WOT for about a mile and a half or so and CHTs got up to about 330º so I backed off for a quarter mile or so and they went below 300º. The bike runs arguably better with the needle here in the top clip vs 2nd to top but definitely seems to run just slightly hotter. Nothing that leads me to believe I need to move it down if I keep an eye on CHTs. This was uphill too. Sounds strange but maybe I need to up the main jet from where it is now at 85 to an 88 or 90? Not sure but I'm happy with where it's at now. If you trust your temp gauge and it is a ring type under the plug 330 is conservative. I run my AC stuff up to 350 regularly, some others go even higher. As long as your WOT temp is fairly stable and does not creep upwards continuously it will work. A common issue when swapping jets is not all jets are marked correctly and there may be differences between brands. Sometimes you swap an 88 in the place of an 84 and the 88 flows the same or less than the 84 did. It sounds like you are really close to where you want to be. A carb setup can be rich down low, perfect in the middle, rich at the top or any combination you can think of. If you feel like getting into it a little further push the atomizer out to see if it is clean and to see which one you have in there. Treatland has those too LoL |
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Post by billwill on Jun 25, 2023 7:51:33 GMT -5
At one point I was WOT for about a mile and a half or so and CHTs got up to about 330º so I backed off for a quarter mile or so and they went below 300º. The bike runs arguably better with the needle here in the top clip vs 2nd to top but definitely seems to run just slightly hotter. Nothing that leads me to believe I need to move it down if I keep an eye on CHTs. This was uphill too. Sounds strange but maybe I need to up the main jet from where it is now at 85 to an 88 or 90? Not sure but I'm happy with where it's at now. If you trust your temp gauge and it is a ring type under the plug 330 is conservative. I run my AC stuff up to 350 regularly, some others go even higher. As long as your WOT temp is fairly stable and does not creep upwards continuously it will work. A common issue when swapping jets is not all jets are marked correctly and there may be differences between brands. Sometimes you swap an 88 in the place of an 84 and the 88 flows the same or less than the 84 did. It sounds like you are really close to where you want to be. A carb setup can be rich down low, perfect in the middle, rich at the top or any combination you can think of. If you feel like getting into it a little further push the atomizer out to see if it is clean and to see which one you have in there. Treatland has those too LoL Good to know... appreciate the perspective and feedback - I'm most happy with the tune I've been. I've just seen on here that 350º is the upper end of the spectrum so when I get close I back off. Maybe I'll throw some miles on it then pull the plug in a bit and see how she looks. Also yeah, I have read that jet sizes can vary and be not-so-reliable. I need to remember that. I am running an 85 main jet now from a non-Dellorto brand and its quite possible that its close to or above a Dellorto 90 main that I have (and ran prior). I did pull out the atomizer yesterday and she looks good but I forget which one it was LOL. Whatever it was, it seemed like the standard based on some quick googling I did at the time. Middle of the road at least. When I get the 50 slide, maybe I'll throw that in and try moving the needle position around. I feel so bad, I've been ordering parts from Treatland and then finding something else I need and having them add to the order haha. Seems like they don't have the most efficient system in place for modifying orders but hey, more business for them. I still need to hook up my Koso temp gauge. Waiting on an extension for that and then I'll be able to. Should come in around the same time I want to pull the plug so that will be convenient timing. |
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Post by 90GTVert on Jun 25, 2023 8:06:05 GMT -5
You should have 10.13:1 final drive gears and that's what your check seems to tell. If you wind up digging into the gearbox, I would suggest converting over to a 3rd support setup and moving to 11.2:1. IMO you don't need the 10:1 gears unless you have a lot of power and are trying to go very fast. I think it's more fun with the deeper gears, and added support in the gearbox is an upgrade. That's all covered in the vid linked below. Also, if you replace the CVT cover bearing, try to find a rubber sealed version. Seemed to work much better for me than the metal shielded type for that spot. youtu.be/UXc93_RUTJ0 |
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Post by billwill on Jun 25, 2023 10:03:11 GMT -5
You should have 10.13:1 final drive gears and that's what your check seems to tell. If you wind up digging into the gearbox, I would suggest converting over to a 3rd support setup and moving to 11.2:1. IMO you don't need the 10:1 gears unless you have a lot of power and are trying to go very fast. I think it's more fun with the deeper gears, and added support in the gearbox is an upgrade. That's all covered in the vid linked below. Also, if you replace the CVT cover bearing, try to find a rubber sealed version. Seemed to work much better for me than the metal shielded type for that spot. youtu.be/UXc93_RUTJ0 Thanks man, good to know. Trying to avoid having to go in there but we’ll see. Just ordered a new clutch bell in hopes it’s either my stock clutch bell that is warped or the cvt cover bearing that is causing the vibrations. I wanted a stage6 mk2 bell but couldn’t find one in 112mm so I settled for a Naraku CNC bell from here: www.dynoscooter.com/products/naraku-112mm-cnc-clutch-bell-v-2-cpi-keeway-and-generic?variant=31965899489420Seemed like a pretty good price. Also ordered an NSK bearing for the cvt cover. I kind of like the idea of having the 10.3:1 just in case I throw the MHR kit back on at a later date. We’ll see. |
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Post by billwill on Jun 25, 2023 10:32:15 GMT -5
I started another thread for this in the help section since I couldn't find anything here on it, but in there lies my experience with the Progress Racing CDI that I had bought before I figured out that the issues I was having were due to a faulty coil. Would be cool to get this working if it offers any improved performance. 49ccscoot.proboards.com/thread/31383/progress-racing-cdi-vento-tritontroubleshooting?page=1&scrollTo=445001I'm guessing I just didn't have it wired up corrected, and the scoot is running fine now with the OEM CDI. If I figure anything out with this, I'll update this thread too.  |
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Post by billwill on Jun 26, 2023 19:47:38 GMT -5
Took off the clutch and sanded the pads and the inside of the clutch bell hoping this might fix some of my vibration issues.
Also down-jetted from 85 main jet to 82 in hopes of dialing the bike in a bit more. I've never liked running the needle clip in the top most clip and that's where I was with the 85 jet so figured I'd give the smaller main a whirl.
Somehow, with the above adjustments, the high RPM vibration is gone and this thing is purring the best it has. Seems like that 82 main is the happiest spot yet. I ended up having to move the needle up one notch so now it's running in the 2nd clip from the top. I may try moving the needle up one more tomorrow.
Right now I am running 7g rollers in it and while it has no trouble here I think I was favoring these because it kept me out of the vibration-prone power band. Right now if I go WOT from a stop, the bike takes off at about 10mph or so it spikes at about 9400 RPM (feels like it has the most power here), and then drops to around 8500 or so as it climbs back up to full speed and revs out around 9200 RPM.
I am thinking I might swap back down to the 6g rollers or a mix of 7's and 6's to see how it does there. Concerned it may affect my top speed but I have about .5mm worth of shims in there to remove and play with if that's the case.
Really happy with this setup so far and I can tell the street race wants more.
I can feel the itch again already for switching back to the MHR cylinder now that feel I've conquered (or come close to conquering) the street race. Tempted to slap a it back on with a c16 or c21 and see what I can do with it.
Question on this... I used to run the MHR with an open air filter and that thing was a hellion. No way I am going back to that being the responsible (somewhat) adult and friendly neighbor I am these days LOL. If I were to put the airbox I have now on the MHR would it be about as loud as it is now? I don't even remember running it back in the day with the stock airbox. Would it even be able to run with the airbox?
Here I go getting carried away again.
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Post by aeroxbud on Jun 27, 2023 3:02:58 GMT -5
You should be able to run the air box fine if it was the MHR replica cylinder. The pod filters can be as loud as the exhaust in some cases.
The C16 is a bit louder than the R.
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Post by billwill on Jun 27, 2023 6:58:35 GMT -5
You should be able to run the air box fine if it was the MHR replica cylinder. The pod filters can be as loud as the exhaust in some cases. The C16 is a bit louder than the R. Gotcha... yeah this is the full MHR, not rep. Would the full MHR struggle with anything but a pod filter? Decisions decisions... |
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Post by aeroxbud on Jun 27, 2023 14:45:52 GMT -5
I've only run a race cylinder with a pod filter. Mainly because it's easier with the larger size carb needed.
Brent was running the TPR86 cylinder with the air box. So it is possible.
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Post by 190mech on Jun 27, 2023 18:05:50 GMT -5
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Post by billwill on Jun 27, 2023 20:36:28 GMT -5
I've only run a race cylinder with a pod filter. Mainly because it's easier with the larger size carb needed. Brent was running the TPR86 cylinder with the air box. So it is possible. Yeah when they get to have such a big inlet I can see that being an issue. I'll check out Brent's build thread on that, I'm sure he has it well-documented :-D Awesome thank you 190mech! |
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Post by billwill on Jun 29, 2023 5:31:54 GMT -5
Order from Treatlandia just arrived yesterday with the 50 slide and manual (non-cabled) choke. Threw the choke on and replaced the tired and worn out remote choke. Started the scoot up to verify it ran the same and all was well. Then I threw on the 50 slide and took the bike for a ride. There seems to be a vast improvement in throttle response and snappiness from 0-1/2-ish throttle. I'm not sure of the science or mechanics behind it but my theory is that this 21mm carb is just a bit large for my application and I had the carb tuned down a bit (with 82 main and 36 pilot). Opening up the amount of air the bike was receiving at 0-1/2 throttle (where I may have been experiencing a rich bog) helped the issue. Maybe my pilot jet was still too rich and throwing in the 50 slide improved the mixture down low and this wasn't the best way of improving things. Perhaps I should throw the 40 slide back in and try moving back down to a 34 or 32 pilot? Not sure but its running pretty good as is now. I kept an eye on CHT's during the test ride and they were fine. Nothing concerning or much different from before. Funny, I wrote that bit above about 0-1/2 throttle and then figured I'd reference my thoughts with the chart that oldgeek posted earlier in this thread and its spot on with that. As a reminder:  To summarize my current thinking and questions for the geniuses on this board who may see this: - Should I be concerned about lean conditions with the 50 slide? CHTs seem fine so I'm thinking no.
- Is it worth swapping back down to the 40 slide and leaning out the pilot jet? The bike still starts without the choke when cold but not as well as with the choke on.
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